The Rose Garden and White House happenings: Listening to voters’ concerns

Google ….

That's interesting. I didn't know Comcast owned Sky.

mtierney said:

Google ….

 the clip you linked to was Sky News Australia.  Google THAT one.

ml1 said:

mtierney said:

Google ….

 the clip you linked to was Sky News Australia.  Google THAT one.

 https://www.smh.com.au/business/companies/news-corp-buys-sky-news-in-australia-and-new-zealand-from-seven-and-nine-20161201-gt1kuz.html

Perfect: smh.com.

ml1 said:

drummerboy said:

 forget it. we're far down another Smedley rabbit hole.

 yup. The point has been lost. 

Biden cognitive decline, pundits, polls, blah, blah blah. 

Like, who cares about the substance if we can talk about the optics and the polls? 

 You can disagree if you want (though you’ve been on both sides of this issue). But whether you agree or disagree, questioning whether the President is fit to carry out his sworn oath of office, and command the military, is hardly “nitpicking”, nor is it a shallow, superficial exercise in optics. It’s an important and substantial issue. 

Smedley said:

 You can disagree if you want (though you’ve been on both sides of this issue). But whether you agree or disagree, questioning whether the President is fit to carry out his sworn oath of office, and command the military, is hardly “nitpicking”, nor is it a shallow, superficial exercise in optics. It’s an important and substantial issue. 

It is. But because your suspicion is neither provable nor disprovable without access to Biden's medical records, it's an empty discussion point. A dead end. 

So you moved on to polls and pundit BS to bolster your empty argument. 

Well by that same standard, it should have been an empty discussion point, a dead end, wrt Trump not releasing his taxes. Without access to the tax returns, suspicions of cheating or sleazy behavior were neither provable nor disprovable. Right? Yet, it was a robust discussion on here, which I don’t recall you throwing shade on. 

Smedley said:

Well by that same standard, it should have been an empty discussion point, a dead end, wrt Trump not releasing his taxes. Without access to the tax returns, suspicions of cheating or sleazy behavior were neither provable nor disprovable. Right? Yet, it was a robust discussion on here, which I don’t recall you throwing shade on. 

Arguing for the sake of arguing. Doesn’t it get old?

Your issues with your perceptions of Biden’s cognition are well documented. And noted.

Lots of counter-arguments, which you clearly don’t agree are persuasive.

Can we move on?

Smedley said:

Well by that same standard, it should have been an empty discussion point, a dead end, wrt Trump not releasing his taxes. Without access to the tax returns, suspicions of cheating or sleazy behavior were neither provable nor disprovable. Right? Yet, it was a robust discussion on here, which I don’t recall you throwing shade on. 

 what a terrible analogy. The NYT did an extensive investigation into the Trump family's financial chicanery. There was a ton of evidence of previous misbehavior.

OTOH you are pulling accusations of Biden's cognitive decline straight out of your ****. 

Maybe “cognitive decline” is presumed  because Biden is 79 and ageism is alive and well. Maybe, however, the behavior dates back decades.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2021/08/26/clueless_joe_sticking_to_his_unloaded_guns_146309.html

Translation: "Ageism is terrible, except in the case of Democrats"

mtierney said:

Maybe “cognitive decline” is presumed  because Biden is 79 and ageism is alive and well. Maybe, however, the behavior dates back decades.

ml1 said:

Smedley said:

Well by that same standard, it should have been an empty discussion point, a dead end, wrt Trump not releasing his taxes. Without access to the tax returns, suspicions of cheating or sleazy behavior were neither provable nor disprovable. Right? Yet, it was a robust discussion on here, which I don’t recall you throwing shade on. 

 what a terrible analogy. The NYT did an extensive investigation into the Trump family's financial chicanery. There was a ton of evidence of previous misbehavior.

OTOH you are pulling accusations of Biden's cognitive decline straight out of your ****. 

 My understanding is that any NYT investigation "of Trump family's financial chicanery" was done WITHOUT subpoena power.  Meaning that the "ton of evidence" was not verified as to completeness nor accuracy.  Additionally, most reporters, even from the NYT, are lay-persons.  Meaning that their opinions are interesting but NOT dispositive.

Surely, Smedley's opinions, as a lay-person, regarding Biden's cognitive state are worthy of being heard.  Despite Smedley"s lack of medical records (or subpoena power to compel production of such records).  Rules of evidence generally allow lay-person testimony.  I cannot imagine why a higher  standard would exist here on MOL.

Meanwhile, the foreseeable just happened…

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/explosion-rocks-kabul-airport-as-us-tries-to-evacuate-thousands-506937

RealityForAll said:

ml1 said:

Smedley said:

Well by that same standard, it should have been an empty discussion point, a dead end, wrt Trump not releasing his taxes. Without access to the tax returns, suspicions of cheating or sleazy behavior were neither provable nor disprovable. Right? Yet, it was a robust discussion on here, which I don’t recall you throwing shade on. 

 what a terrible analogy. The NYT did an extensive investigation into the Trump family's financial chicanery. There was a ton of evidence of previous misbehavior.

OTOH you are pulling accusations of Biden's cognitive decline straight out of your ****. 

 My understanding is that any NYT investigation "of Trump family's financial chicanery" was done WITHOUT subpoena power.  Meaning that the "ton of evidence" was not verified as to completeness nor accuracy.  Additionally, most reporters, even from the NYT, are lay-persons.  Meaning that their opinions are interesting but NOT dispositive.

Surely, Smedley's opinions, as a lay-person, regarding Biden's cognitive state are worthy of being heard.  Despite Smedley"s lack of medical records (or subpoena power to compel production of such records).  Rules of evidence generally allow lay-person testimony.  I cannot imagine why a higher  standard would exist here on MOL.

nobody is saying anyone's opinions shouldn't be heard.  Go ahead, opinion away.  But if there's no evidence for someone's opinion (and in this case there is truly zero), they should expect to get a response to that effect.  To further use the tax return analogy, it would be evidence, even if it wasn't presented in court under oath, if someone close to Biden leaked his medical records to a major news outlet, and they contained evidence of mental decline.  Then any speculation has at least some evidentiary basis other than one's own orifice.

but a better response from me would have been this:

what a terrible analogy.  A better parallel to Trump's refusal to release his tax returns would be if Biden promised that like every president in recent history, he'd release the results of his annual physical.  And then he reneged year after year to do so.  On its face that would be reasonable cause to be suspicious that the president was hiding some sort of physical, psychological or mental illness.  Just like a refusal year after year to release the promised tax returns.

mtierney said:

Meanwhile, the foreseeable just happened…

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/explosion-rocks-kabul-airport-as-us-tries-to-evacuate-thousands-506937

I'm confused.  Was this bombing different from bombings occurring in Afghanistan with tragic regularity since 1979?

mtierney said:

Meanwhile, the foreseeable just happened…

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/explosion-rocks-kabul-airport-as-us-tries-to-evacuate-thousands-506937

 Yes, it was foreseeable, and yes, it happened. Your point?

It was more than foreseeable. We knew it was going to happen since yesterday.

as of the last news report, 12 US military personnel are dead and many seriously wounded; numerous Afghan citizens are dead, and many wounded. 

tjohn said:

mtierney said:

Meanwhile, the foreseeable just happened…

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/explosion-rocks-kabul-airport-as-us-tries-to-evacuate-thousands-506937

I'm confused.  Was this bombing different from bombings occurring in Afghanistan with tragic regularity since 1979?

 Yes. 

.

It’s like she couldn’t wait to post about dead US soldiers. As for Biden’s cognitive decline because he’s 78….. MT is 80. Really should not be making these types of analogies…

mtierney said:

as of the last news report, 12 US military personnel are dead and many seriously wounded; numerous Afghan citizens are dead, and many wounded. 

tjohn said:

mtierney said:

Meanwhile, the foreseeable just happened…

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/explosion-rocks-kabul-airport-as-us-tries-to-evacuate-thousands-506937

I'm confused.  Was this bombing different from bombings occurring in Afghanistan with tragic regularity since 1979?

 Yes. 

Let me help you out here.  In your twisted world, this bombing is different because it happened on Joe Biden's watch.  There are no other differences between this bombing and hundreds or thousands before it.

Just get TF out. Yes, it's gonna suck for millions of Afghans. Yet another years'-long U.S. blunder with no pol willing to admit we fcuked up again until Biden shut it down. Everyone wanted the end; no one had the balls to admit or execute it. It's ugly. Cue the armchair generals.

I fear that many of the Afghans left behind, certainly those who worked with United States and its allies, will suffer punishment and death; and the women and girls, who saw the world they could have made a difference in, closed down to them.  

The shocking information learned today was the fact that the US gave the names of all the Afghans who have yet to been evacuated to the Taliban.

President Biden was vice president for eight years in Obama’s two terms. He served in Congress during the Vietnam debacle. Why hasn’t  that experience given him wisdom? 

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/joe-biden-afghanistan-kabul-presidency-506970

mtierney said:

The shocking information learned today was the fact that the US gave the names of all the Afghans who have yet to been evacuated to the Taliban.

The article doesn’t say the U.S. gave the names of “all” the Afghans who have yet to be evacuated; it says the names were Afghans who were being evacuated, during a certain period. It also doesn’t say whether any of them failed to make it through.

mtierney said:

I fear that many of the Afghans left behind, certainly those who worked with United States and its allies, will suffer punishment and death; and the women and girls, who saw the world they could have made a difference in, closed down to them.  

The shocking information learned today was the fact that the US gave the names of all the Afghans who have yet to been evacuated to the Taliban.

President Biden was vice president for eight years in Obama’s two terms. He served in Congress during the Vietnam debacle. Why hasn’t  that experience given him wisdom? 

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/joe-biden-afghanistan-kabul-presidency-506970

His experience did give him wisdom.  That's why he decided it was time to end our pointless occupation of Afghanistan.  

Was your alternative to stay there forever? 

An objective recap on what’s happening in Afghanistan …

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/08/27/what-isis-k-means-for-afghanistan-507034

Excerpt for folks who don’t click on links:

“According to the head of U.S. Central Command, General Kenneth McKenzie, the U.S. has been providing the Taliban sanitized intelligence on ISIS-K threats in Kabul since Aug. 14. Further, he gave credit to the Taliban for having taken action on that intelligence, saying “we believe that some attacks have been thwarted by them.” So one opportunity is to build on this relationship of counterterrorism cooperation, at least insofar as it applies to the common enemy of ISIS-K.

A significant challenge, however, is how far to take such cooperation given both the political and operational risks. For example, the reported provision by the U.S. to the Taliban of names of Americans and Afghans that the U.S. wanted to be let through Taliban checkpoints created political uproar at home, with critics claiming that such action amounted to putting those Afghans on a Taliban “kill list.” Another major challenge is the Taliban’s cooperative relationship with jihadist groups beyond ISIS-K. The most notable of these from a U.S. perspective is al-Qaeda, which retains a small presence in Afghanistan and close ties to the Taliban that neither group is likely to sever anytime soon.”

and this passage in that Politico article is just stupid:

The president keeps a card in his pocket with the precise number of troops who have been killed in Iraq and Afghanistan over the last 12 years — numbers that would now jump substantially under his watch.

substantially?  There have been over 2,300 U.S. military personnel killed in Afghanistan, the vast majority of them in the last twelve years.  

mtierney said:

...

The shocking information learned today was the fact that the US gave the names of all the Afghans who have yet to been evacuated to the Taliban.

...

Where the hell do you get your "information" from anyway? This is ridiculously inaccurate. 

drummerboy said:

Where the hell do you get your "information" from anyway? This is ridiculously inaccurate.

There was this Politico article: https://www.politico.com/news/2021/08/26/us-officials-provided-taliban-with-names-of-americans-afghan-allies-to-evacuate-506957