WandaVision - Help me Wanda, is it a Vision?
O M G! That was CRAZY good. This may be a minor thing, but I'm a little conflicted about Director Heyward now. Yeah, I think they could and should do the last episode in two hours. That being said, they have set it up as a continuing show and really could go many seasons with it. It will now be interesting to see how they weave this into the cinematic efforts that are in production (or even out and in the can?).
I feel like I'm going to spoil the after credit scene here, but don't want to do it just yet. I will say I LOVE Cathryn Hahn even more, and the actual naming of Wanda was amazing. Did anyone actually read the "House of M' comics? I have no idea what all those ruins are all about. I will say it was awesome to see that witches coven in the beginning. OK, time to read some Flipboard articles.
I just hope they can find a smart, fresh way to end it and not with an overly long CGI driven super power punch fest, which to me is the formulaic bane of a lot of the Marvel movies.
The reference to the classic walnuts episode of Dick Van Dyke (Danny Thomas was in it), gave us big smiles.
bub said:
I just hope they can find a smart, fresh way to end it and not with an overly long CGI driven super power punch fest, which to me is the formulaic bane of a lot of the Marvel movies.
The reference to the classic walnuts episode of Dick Van Dyke (Danny Thomas was in it), gave us big smiles.
No, I think they've proven they won't go that route, though they do tease it in all the fan based articles I've read this morning. Truthfully, I read all of it with much skepticism. We've talked about it here, but the reality is that the so called 'Marvel Universe' and the comic book universe are so separate as to almost not be related. Fans who read the original comics like to speculate that they have all the answers. The reality is that there is a reason they keep it all secret, especially in an serial show like this. They want you to keep coming back, talking and speculating. The 'pay off' is more involved this time, I think.
I hope I'm not wrong, by the way. You could very well get a battle of some sort, but I think it will be less obvious who will actually do battle. Then again, they could keep it to under an hour again to set up both the Dr. Strange movie and the next season of WandaVision. I hope there is not a......wait for it.....Double Vision episode (heh, heh, heh - I'm so clever).
I think I'm going to stop reading articles predicting the next and final episode, because the vary from being amazingly stupid to incredibly depressing. Fan theories can be so lame, don't you think? I'm enjoying all the back and forth here and hope we can continue to talk about the next series which will be here before you know it......(checking my Disney+).......Falcon and the Winter Soldier March 19th. There has been some chatter about rewatching Avengers Age of Ultron and other movies for 'continuity'. I'm going to throw a theory of my own out there, forgive my geekiness. I think they are going to put some new twists in and try not to give the audience what they expect this time around. They've set up this show that way for sure. There will always be someone who is disappointed in not getting what they expect, but that is their loss as far as I'm concerned. It would certainly be sad if this is a 'one off' series, but who really cares? It's entertaining, and certainly not boring in terms of what they did.
It's sad to lose a good show but its also sad when they stretch out a show for more years just for the money well beyond the show's real payoff.
bub said:
It's sad to lose a good show but its also sad when they stretch out a show for more years just for the money well beyond the show's real payoff.
I agree 100%. I'm just happy there is buzz about this show, because I have a little confession to make. My feeling was that if they had not ramped up and explained the whole sitcom thing as fast as they did, they would have lost the younger audience for this show. So what they did was pretty smart, but if this show was just a platform to build onto their other properties, then so be it. In terms of production, those special effects have got to be expensive and they have to justify people watching to maintain it. It's not like a comic book, where all you really depend on is a good story and someone who can draw and ink it. For me, they put a fresh spin on something that was actually getting a bit boring.
I sort of feel the same way about another show that just started, Superman & Lois. Yeah, they have the flying and Super crap, but he is also a dad of two teenage boys that are mad at him for not being around for them. I'm not a fan of The Boys, by the way. A bit too over the top for me, and some of the graphic violence is very disturbing to watch.
TheJmon said:
bub said:
It's sad to lose a good show but its also sad when they stretch out a show for more years just for the money well beyond the show's real payoff.
I agree 100%. I'm just happy there is buzz about this show, because I have a little confession to make. My feeling was that if they had not ramped up and explained the whole sitcom thing as fast as they did, they would have lost the younger audience for this show. So what they did was pretty smart, but if this show was just a platform to build onto their other properties, then so be it. In terms of production, those special effects have got to be expensive and they have to justify people watching to maintain it. It's not like a comic book, where all you really depend on is a good story and someone who can draw and ink it. For me, they put a fresh spin on something that was actually getting a bit boring.
I sort of feel the same way about another show that just started, Superman & Lois. Yeah, they have the flying and Super crap, but he is also a dad of two teenage boys that are mad at him for not being around for them. I'm not a fan of The Boys, by the way. A bit too over the top for me, and some of the graphic violence is very disturbing to watch.
Agree
My gen-z son really had trouble at the beginning, the sitcoms meant nothing to him. He thinks that's why they dropped the first two episodes together, to help the youngers zip through that part without taking away the fun for us geriatricals.
I also agree with ending the show. I can think of any number of good shows that went on too many episodes (or seasons).
As for The Boys, I'm not watching the series for a couple of reasons (don't have Prime is one) but I do find the violence in graphic novels to be easier to take than on screen, big or little. In the books (available from the Maplewood Public Library on Hoopla, btw) the violence is stylized and works within the context of what I think is a novel and well-done story. I do know the books are not universally loved because they explore a darker side of what powered individuals would mean in the world than Marvel or even DC are willing to look at.
max_weisenfeld said:
Agree
My gen-z son really had trouble at the beginning, the sitcoms meant nothing to him. He thinks that's why they dropped the first two episodes together, to help the youngers zip through that part without taking away the fun for us geriatricals.
I also agree with ending the show. I can think of any number of good shows that went on too many episodes (or seasons).
As for The Boys, I'm not watching the series for a couple of reasons (don't have Prime is one) but I do find the violence in graphic novels to be easier to take than on screen, big or little. In the books (available from the Maplewood Public Library on Hoopla, btw) the violence is stylized and works within the context of what I think is a novel and well-done story. I do know the books are not universally loved because they explore a darker side of what powered individuals would mean in the world than Marvel or even DC are willing to look at.
You got that right. In the first show, that speedster guy literally blows through a girl and the splatter gets all over her boyfriend. That's a bit too much for me, no matter how good the acting is. I kept with it for a bit, just to see if they continued in that vein. They did, and it was majorly disturbing. That consistent presentation of shock value disguised at making something more 'real' is a big problem with entertainment in general. I like my action to be a little more cerebral.
Re the Boys, I really like it but the violence and tension is too much and I've long put off watching the last two episodes for that reason. The guy who plays Homelander deserves an award. Just the sight of him showing up in a scene raises my blood pressure out of fear of what he is going to do. Terrific portrayal of a sociopath.
It's pity because it's a good story. Too bad the producers chose to go so graphic
max_weisenfeld said:
It's pity because it's a good story. Too bad the producers chose to go so graphic
Yes, absolutely. I still get creeped out by that first scene, and I can watch a good decapitation with the best of them. To a lesser extent, they tried to do that with the DC films of recent, with much less success in my humble opinion. That Justice League film was a hot mess, and no amount of 'Directors Cut' will salvage what was a terrible film to begin with. The point being they are trying to do exactly what The Boys succeeded in doing, but without the gore and moral ambiguity.
I have found a lot of the great shows of this era of great TV to be too stressful and I've stopped watching some of them for that reason. They're too real in a world that provides me with enough real anxiety. For a while now, our movie and TV choices have shifted towards the more upbeat, funny, uplifting, humane etc..
A very good point indeed. The other part of the equation is how transient everything is these days - we move on from the 'great' to the next 'great' very quickly. Me? I like to watch the stuff that got away and the things I enjoyed when I was younger take on new or trusted enjoyment. I'm watching Magnum Force at the moment, what's better than Dirty Harry? I'll take that kind of drama to most of the in your face stuff of today hands down.
Has anyone tried the 'Group Watch' feature? I'm game to watch from the beginning, though we made need some distance before making the attempt. Anyone interested in trying it for this?
Since I said it, I know someone is going to 'spoil' Episode 9, but I've yet to watch. There have been several articles kvetching about the run time, as I've mentioned. I'm good with this show not coming back, as they did it nicely and it's not like you won't see these characters again elsewhere. I doubt we'll see them in Falcon and The Winter Soldier, though. What If? Looks interesting, but it's animated so has lost some of the magic for me. Loki? Meh, he annoyed me in the films and will continue to annoy me on Disney+, but I'll watch it anyway because of the actor. (He is doing the voiceover for a nature series on Apple TV, anyone see it?)
In terms of Films, I'm not looking forward to anything but Black Widow......
If your gonna mention Dirty Harry, I have to give a nod to its underappreciated director, Don Siegel,who also directed the original Invasion of the Body Snatchers (an all time fave), Charley Varrick, a little seen but terrific gritty bank heist movie from the 70s with Walter Matheau, and Escape from Alcatraz, among many others.
bub said:
If your gonna mention Dirty Harry, I have to give a nod to its underappreciated director, Don Siegel,who also directed the original Invasion of the Body Snatchers (an all time fave), Charley Varrick, a little seen but terrific gritty bank heist movie from the 70s with Walter Matheau, and Escape from Alcatraz, among many others.
The original, not the remake, correct? Yah, that was a good movie. Charley Varrick sounds familiar, but I don't think I would search that out on purpose. Escape from Alcatraz? Right up there with The Eiger Sanction and Papillon if you ask me. I started watching The Graduate the other day, but time has passed that poor movie and all I want to do is listen to the soundtrack and skip to the end. Funny to think of that movie as a kid coming home from college. Could you imagine the updated version? That would make a funny film....or not.
Finale disappointing in the way that I feared. Oh well. It was fun while it lasted.
bub said:
Finale disappointing in the way that I feared. Oh well. It was fun while it lasted.
I would have to agree with you on this one, but I would go even deeper on this (and you may think this is a bit Conspiracy Theory, but I don't care 
) As with any large company, Disney/Marvel is all about 'selling tickets'. To that end, they have given the fans what they want, even if it's just the chatter. I'm not that geek anymore, but there are MANY that still are and always will be. They didn't have to 'get it right', but leaving it all so open was exactly what they wanted to do. You need look no further than the fact that they started doing the 'mid credit' and 'after credit' teases early on in the movie franchise. Bringing it here to a limited TV series was calculated and planned way before anyone saw it air. They make no bones about how secretive they are in revealing plot and character, it's how they keep the machine going. So to that end, they left enough things open to actually accomplish what they set out to do.
I'm gonna geek out here for a second, as I literally just had this conversation with my 13 year old daughter (who is WAY more into all this). We were talking over lunch on the whole Adam Warlock thread and when he would show up again. If anyone remembers, he shows up briefly in the after credits of the second Guardians of the Galaxy movie. I will tell you that I read the original Warlock comic back in the early 70s, and it got a reboot in the decades that followed. This was as departure from that, but hinted at a major story arc. Nothing happened, and I predicted with her that nothing would. This in itself is my point, by the way. Two distinct generations were talking about something in a way that keeps it all going, regardless of wether we are right or wrong. Welcome to the Machine.
Sorry, I like this article, so I have to post it.
https://www.salon.com/2021/03/06/wandavision-finale-martin-scorsese/
Hmm. I'm still not convinced. I watched the last 2 Avengers movies last weekend, which were ridiculous, but at least Wandavision had some level of humanity to it, and it took a little longer before they all started flying around and smashing things.
I'll admit to losing interest in superhero comics when I discovered 2000AD in the early 80s, and as such these things probably aren't for me. But I've had no problem with superhero movies over the years up until the first Avengers movie (excluding Guardians of the Galaxy, which was a lot of fun). Since then, every single one has gotten more and more ridiculous (including Guardians of the Galaxy 2), and I care less and less about anyone in these stories, and I just wish they'd use the money they spend on these things to make better films.
No matter how worn out a genre seems, someone with real enthusiasm, imagination, and skill can come along and revive it. Most of this series did that but in the end they caved big time to tired Marvel formula and revealed that they were winging in it with a slapdash finale.
ridski said:
Hmm. I'm still not convinced. I watched the last 2 Avengers movies last weekend, which were ridiculous, but at least Wandavision had some level of humanity to it, and it took a little longer before they all started flying around and smashing things.
I'll admit to losing interest in superhero comics when I discovered 2000AD in the early 80s, and as such these things probably aren't for me. But I've had no problem with superhero movies over the years up until the first Avengers movie (excluding Guardians of the Galaxy, which was a lot of fun). Since then, every single one has gotten more and more ridiculous (including Guardians of the Galaxy 2), and I care less and less about anyone in these stories, and I just wish they'd use the money they spend on these things to make better films.
I would settle for them using the money they make from them to make better films
bub said:
No matter how worn out a genre seems, someone with real enthusiasm, imagination, and skill can come along and revive it. Most of this series did that but in the end they caved big time to tired Marvel formula and revealed that they were winging in it with a slapdash finale.
Disagree on the slapdash ending. I would say GOT was a slapdash ending. You must be looking forward to the Snyder cut of that hot mess Justice League movie.
Some questions:
Wanda turns Agatha back into Agnes so that, what, Agnes will wander around Westview by herself since its "citizens" and the WV family are no longer there? Does Westview even exist without Wanda around?
What was the difference between Hayward's official mission and his true objective that turned him rogue? What was his motivation? And how did he and his troops get through the force field and how did they know they could do it?
Not a plot hole exactly but a disappointment. Kat Denning's smart funny character's role in the finale reduced to crashing into Hayward's Humvee. There's a slight.
Wanda's powers were so immense that she created the Vision and the kids and they weren't just illusions. They were self aware. Why did she need to enslave real people to fill her fantasy town?
A lot of questions, grasshopper. I'll get back to you tomorrow, or you can read the many articles before then....
What did Speed do to the troops that came in with Hayward, and why did they spend the rest of the battle just standing around?
OK, I think I'm stepping out of this thread. I was looking for thoughtful conversation with people that were into the whole thing.I got some initially, and then got this. If I want snarky, I have SO many other options (including those that don't involve my computer). rids, you are clearly having some fun at my expense, so have a good time with it, dude. bub, more of the same with you my friend. You guys can play here together, I'm done providing fodder for your silliness.
I feel like we've been here before many moons ago, by the way. No pleasure in the memories for me.
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