Star Wars VII: The Force Awakens (spoiler thread)

Rey being Jaina Solo Ben's twin doesn't make sense in the context of all Han and Leia's talking about their missing/bad son, with no word of a daughter. The "you actually had twins, but passed out after delivering the first and never knew you had a second baby" storyline would be too soapy for Star Wars, I think. Either she's Luke's, or she's unrelated and descended from some other, presumably now-deceased, Jedi ... but given her inherent talent for flying and Anakin/Luke's lightsaber calling to / going to her, I'm pretty sure she's going to turn out to be a Skywalker. 

I think that Han (and maybe even) Leia have no idea they had a daughter. I think the baby taken away at birth is exactly the storyline they'll go with. 

That's some Heather Webber level crap right there. Though I guess I have to realize she's a Skywalker regardless if her mom is Leia or her dad is Luke, so her flying skills don't really point either way. (And it's not like Han isn't a great pilot either.) Ah who knows. 

All I know is that if you use that blue lightsaber, your hand is totally getting cut off.

Best evidence for this.  Han seems to recognize her when they meet.  When Maz asks about her to Han, the camera cuts away.  She's either Ben's twin or Luke's kid.

conandrob240 said:

yes, that, how similar Rey was to Han and a line that said something like "like the father you never had" made me think they were setting it up for Rey to be Ben's twin.

ridski said:

It would be great if we had somebody who wasn't a Skywalker being a Jedi for once. It reinforces the lesson that anyone should be able to open themselves to it and become one with the Force, and that it's not just a combination of Mithras-like virgin-births and Kwisatz Haderach-style bloodline manipulation.

While being Skywalker isn't a prerequisite to being strong in the force, it also isn't true that just anyone can open themselves up to the force.  Some have it, some don't.  Before the Jedi were wiped out when a young child was found to be strong in the force they were then trained by the Jedi.  If someone isn't born strong in the force then no amount of training in the world would make them a Jedi master, no matter how open their minds were to the process.

spontaneous said:

ridski said:

It would be great if we had somebody who wasn't a Skywalker being a Jedi for once. It reinforces the lesson that anyone should be able to open themselves to it and become one with the Force, and that it's not just a combination of Mithras-like virgin-births and Kwisatz Haderach-style bloodline manipulation.

While being Skywalker isn't a prerequisite to being strong in the force, it also isn't true that just anyone can open themselves up to the force.  Some have it, some don't.  Before the Jedi were wiped out when a young child was found to be strong in the force they were then trained by the Jedi.  If someone isn't born strong in the force then no amount of training in the world would make them a Jedi master, no matter how open their minds were to the process.

Yeah, that's why they had to wipe the extended universe. It's no fun.

I think she'll in some way be related to Obi-Wan. That way, Luke can train her, just as Obi-Wan trained him. Then Luke can die in episode VIII--as Obi-Wan did in episode IV--in a duel with Kylo, and then come back as a ghost in episode IX.

@relx mind=blown.

just saw it. What a great movie. I like the idea that Rey is somehow related to Obi Wan. I saw a theory that she's Ben's sister and went to train with Luke with Ben; and when Ben went all crazy, Han and Leia abandoned/hid her to protect her from him. Maybe her force is stronger and he hates that.  

But then I saw something that it was Ewan MacGregor's voice calling her in the hallucination scene and I like that way more, somehow. My husband only wants to believe that she's a scavenger and a "normal" person can be a Jedi. I like that too, but discussing theories is fun.

I liked how Han and Leia didn't totally dig each other--I always hate it when characters get together during extenuating circumstances and you're like "well THIS is never gonna last." Han and Chewy though, oh man. That got me crying. Han and Chewy is true love, for real. 

Adam Driver was awesome. And Rey is the best character. Ever. 

check out Twitter for Emo Kylo Ren

Loved the movie. 

I hope Rey is not a long lost twin of Ben's.  The plot line that Leia and Han didn't know there was another child is too soap opera for me. It bothers me that Darth Vader and C -3PO don't recognize each other and that Vader didn't know Luke had a twin, so another story line where people who should know each other well and don't would be too much.  

I wonder if Rey could be a clone like the storm troopers. Since all of the Jedi were killed off maybe Luke was trying re build the order with clones?  

They are also leaving so many clues that she is a Skywalker that it seems that they are trying to mislead everyone on purpose. 

I think the next episode will have some flashbacks. They made a point to note that C-3PO had a red arm, why? That woman also said there was a long story about how she got the light saber.  Didn't  Luke loose his light saber in The Empire Strikes Back. I remember Vader saying something about Luke constructing a new one in return of the Jedi.

A few things a really enjoyed  

I liked when Kylo stopped the phaser blast in mid air  

I liked how the Storm troopers had some personality

I liked that some of the dogfight scenes were on the planet instead of out in space  

A few thing I didn't like  

Chewbacca's reaction to Han dying was passed over. The scene where Han was being frozen on the carbonate was so powerful. This seemed a little tame  

I thought it was strange that they had R2-D2 in the garage under a tarp. They always imply that some droids have personallity and people here at them as more than utility items. After all they went through together they put him in the garage like an old excercise bike  

Boba Fett, any movie universe that  contains Boba Fett should have him in every scene possible  

Boba Fett snowflake. 

Most of my dislikes were some of the dialog:

Some of Finn's lines seemed too 'current day American'. He was raised by the First Order. They don't speak like us, and you don't start speaking like us just because you've had an epiphany.

Rey's first efforts at using the force included convincing a storm trooper to "Remove these restraints and leave this cell with the door open..."  How does she know this type of mind control works?  Did she see the previous movies?

I thought more would happen with Captain Phasma. A quick threat with a gun, and she let down the shields, seemed too easy.

if there is such legend and myth around the Jedi and Luke Skywalker, I would imagine everyone has heard stories about the various powers. Her use of the force that way doesn't bother me

The storm trooper was not Rey's first time using the force. Repelling Kylo Ren's psychic assault in a bid to get information from her was her first time using the force. I think that is what made her realize she had this power.  

spontaneous said:

The storm trooper was not Rey's first time using the force. Repelling Kylo Ren's psychic assault in a bid to get information from her was her first time using the force. I think that is what made her realize she had this power.  

I know she realized her power during Kylo's psychic assault. But it seems like one talent to read minds. A different one to mind control. I just thought her 'testing it out until it worked' could have been made to look more like she was learning how to do it, than by just saying the same thing over and over... especially after 007 called her 'scavenger scum'.

I haven't read any of this thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating something, but did anyone else think that Boyega was terribly miscast? I got no energy from him at all, and there was less than zero chemistry between he and Ray (who I think was awesome.)

I thought he was great. As far as chemistry, it was obvious that she is supposed to be somewhat adversarial towards Finn, she makes it clear that she is NOT a damsel in need of rescue. That is the script talking, not missing chemistry between actors. 

I thought he was great, but already commented that I thought his lines were too contemporary American. When he says "boyfriend", it threw me out of the movie. No ex-storm trooper is going to say "boyfriend". They're going to have some other word for it... if storm troopers even have relationships.

The other line that threw me out of the movie was Leia lamenting when she "sent him away", when talking about Ben. 

But a parent doesn't send their kid "away", they send them "to" something... "sent him to train", "sent him to grow up",  anything. Or if they didn't want the script to commit to something they hadn't written yet (which struck me as the likely reason for that strange line), just leave it hanging like "sent him to...".

Yes, she sent him to Luke to banish his dark side but in her hind sight and guilt and regret, she thought of it as having "sent him away". Makes perfect sense to me.

And, no, didn't think any were miscast at all. I was skeptical seeing trailers but after seeing them in the movie, I loved all the leads and think they were just perfect!

conandrob240 said:

Yes, she sent him to Luke to banish his dark side but in her hind sight and guilt and regret, she thought of it as having "sent him away". Makes perfect sense to me.

I don't actually think she was referring to the training from Luke with the "sent him away" statement... because if she was, I think it would have been more explicit.

what else would she have meant? She sent him away to live/train with Luke because of his dark side. It resulted in disaster & she never saw him again.

Cannot believe they didn't have Admiral Akbar say, "ITS ANOTHER TRAP!!"

conandrob240 said:

what else would she have meant? She sent him away to live/train with Luke because of his dark side. It resulted in disaster & she never saw him again.

It seemed possible that she had Ben train with Luke because Luke was training a new generation of Jedi. As Luke seems to think it was his fault Ben went to the Dark side, it seems possible that Ben didn't turn to the Dark Side until some point during or after his training, no?

not the way I understood it. She sent him to train with Luke because " he always had too much Vader in him" but also light which she was hoping Luke could make primary.

I have not read every single comment in this discussion.  We took the kids yesterday, and I left speechless and in tears (I'm a GEEK).  I was SO happy to have stayed away from any spoilers.  That instant where Kylo Ren... well, it's still raw to me, and I turned to my husband and said "They did NOT just do that!"   The final scene, no dialogue... was amazing and so well done.  

Rey... well... Rey is a badass, and I instantly fell in love with her.    Has it been discussed yet, that maybe it's possible Rey is Lukes daughter?   I started to question that when she first found the lightsaber. 

Oh, and I quoted project37 because I agree with every single thing. 

project37 said:

I saw it this afternoon with my 8 year old and...wow. I'm so glad that I managed to steer clear of spoilers, because I didn't see the twists with Han coming.

So much to enjoy. A few random observations:


- I loved the fact that all of the new characters: Finn, Rey, Poe, and even BB-8 were instantly likable.  The timing of introducing the old characters was well-handled and well-executed. It really felt like a passing of the torch and I'd be happy seeing the new cast as the true leads going forward.

- Nice touch to have a Resistance fighter load critical information into a droid, who then wanders a desert planet looking for help.


- Kylo Ren was considerably more interesting than Darth Maul (who looked awesome, but that was it). It was fantastic to see him lose his cool and take it out on the room.


- Rey is a phenomenal lead character. I really appreciated seeing such a strong woman in the Star Wars universe (kicking ass left and right, even getting annoyed at Finn trying to take her hand). Poor Natalie Portman was reduced to a joke by the end, but there's no way that's happening here. Great to see her hold her own. Captain Phasma looked cool as hell and hopefully gets a bigger role in the next film.

- "That lightsaber belongs to *me.*" "Come and get it." Genuine chills. I liked the lightsaber fights being raw in the spirit of the original trilogy as opposed to the superhero hyper-choreography of the prequels.


- Love the unanswered questions: How was the lightsaber retrieved? Who is the Supreme Leader?  Who are Rey's parents? And maybe one just for me: What happened to Lando?

- That final scene, saving Luke for the very end, and then his wordless performance. The hand! I need to see that moment again as soon as possible.

Things I didn't love so much:


- The music didn't really have any standout cues for me, which was surprising. Even Phantom Menace had the thrilling "Duel of the Fates."

- The scene with Han being cornered by smugglers and the tentacle creatures could have gone and I wouldn't have missed it.

Loved it, and unlike the last few Star Wars movies, I'm looking forward to seeing it again.

In all of these comments speculating who might be related to who, not one mention that Finn's last name might being "Calrissian"???

Yes. This was a rehash for the original audience. However, the one difference was that the perspective shifted for the original audience.

When I was a kid and learned that Darth Vader was Luke's, my hero's, father, it was an emotional realization because I was a kid and parental imperfection was an emotional hot button. It worked.

In The Force Awakens the point of view is now parental. Han and Leia had a child, Ben, who is the new dark lord. It presses the buttons of the original audience to think that their child would turn to the dark side. It's a different hot button. It worked.

Those of us who grew up with the pain that the father was the dark lord, now have to deal with the idea that the child we raised could be the dark lord. What parent isn't moved by the scene on the bridge? It's not for kids. It's for parents of kids.

It's not for the Prequel addicts, or people who complain that Ackbar didn't say, "It's a trap!" Its for the adults who grew up with the Original Trilogy.