SO Property Reval 2016-17

this is South Orange Specific.

sac said:

Steve said:

Vivaldo said:

Does it say what your new taxes will be?

I *think* that if your proposed assessed value is more than 27% above the current assessed value, your property taxes should increase. If below, then it should decrease.

... except that the total amount of the budget increases every year, so the taxes will increase for more households than decrease. But if your proposed assessed value is exactly 27% above current then the increase should be the same percentage as the total of the budget increases.

If the tax increase is 2%, every homeowner's tax will increase by 2%, regardless of whether the new assessment is more or less than 27%.

Steve said:

but the people asking the questions here do

Hopefully, but my observations were based in large part on what MOLers posted in threads about the various revals, so I would not assume that everyone here has absorbed that.

Sweetsnuggles said:

Has the assessor visited every residence? We are in Maplewood. And have not been contacted by anyone .

When it was mid-September and I hadn't seen any evidence of a visit, I called Appraisal Systems, and they scheduled a visit. (I live in Maplewood.) My impression was that they were still in the thick of the inspection period; still, it wouldn't hurt to call them.

Appraisal Systems is also working in Millburn right now.

After spending about an hour looking through the spreadsheet that is available on the above link, it looks like there is a general trend where the traditionally lower priced neighborhoods have appreciated in value due to demand for affordable houses in South Orange, and will pay higher taxes as a result.

On the other hand, the traditionally higher priced neighborhoods have depreciated in value in comparison - in large part due to the huge legacy tax bills on those properties that depress sale prices, and will pay less. This is especially true on the extreme high end houses.

I have no skin in this game. I'm right in the middle, and my new assessment won't change my taxes in any significant way.

Residents who have questions might be interested in this, from the South Orange website:

Maplewood Reassessment Presentation Streamed live on May 24, 2016:
Representatives from Appraisal Systems Inc. (ASI) gave a presentation on
the upcoming reassessment. They answered questions regarding
residential homes reassessment and the reassessment process. South
Orange will be having their presentation in the near future and will
welcome residents from both towns who may still have questions or
concerns.

Check out this video on YouTube

Well, after seeing my value increase I used the spreadsheet and my taxes are going down a little. Of course, I am doing work so when the permit closes I'm sure they will go back up.

Almost all property increased in value, I think I only saw 18 properties of over 4000 that went down in value. The average increase was 27%. At 27% your taxes stay neutral. The further away from there that you are the more your taxes will go up or down.

FilmCarp said:

Well, after seeing my value increase I used the spreadsheet and my taxes are going down a little. Of course, I am doing work so when the permit closes I'm sure they will go back up.

Thank you!

DaveSchmidt said:

Sweetsnuggles said:

Has the assessor visited every residence? We are in Maplewood. And have not been contacted by anyone .

When it was mid-September and I hadn't seen any evidence of a visit, I called Appraisal Systems, and they scheduled a visit. (I live in Maplewood.) My impression was that they were still in the thick of the inspection period; still, it wouldn't hurt to call them.

Rob_Sandow said:

After spending about an hour looking through the spreadsheet that is available on the above link, it looks like there is a general trend where the traditionally lower priced neighborhoods have appreciated in value due to demand for affordable houses in South Orange, and will pay higher taxes as a result.

On the other hand, the traditionally higher priced neighborhoods have depreciated in value in comparison - in large part due to the huge legacy tax bills on those properties that depress sale prices, and will pay less. This is especially true on the extreme high end houses.

I have no skin in this game. I'm right in the middle, and my new assessment won't change my taxes in any significant way.

That sounds right, and makes a lot of sense. I think that houses in the upper end are a bargain, at least relatively, when compared to other towns. The high taxes are certainly one of the reasons. My impression is that you can get a much larger house in South Orange than you can get in Maplewood, for the same price. Perhaps a realtor or someone who has actually made the comparison when purchasing a house can chime in.

Probably the best way to make a comparison is to compare the dollar per sq. ft. of houses sold in the two towns.

grahamb said:

BK2SO said:

Ok. Did the calculations, and my property tax is $3000 more than it was last year! We have only lived in the house for 2 years, and the only major improvement made was to replace the shingles on the roof. WTF?

I see that someone is up $19k in 4 years....so it could be worse.




What I don't get is how the assessed value relates to market value. If a house just recently sold, I would have thought that the assessed value would match the recent sale. But I see some that are assessed for way under a recent sale, and some that are assessed way over a recent sale. Anyone have any insight there?

but then it would not be a fair comparison to the surrounding houses, on a relative basis. For example, my next door neighbor, whose house is very similar to mine, purchased their house in 1998, whereas I bought mine in 2014. based on the last sale price in the spreadsheet, they paid 40% of what I did (as I gasp for air). But we shouldn't have dissimilar tax levels for similar houses. Another example is my other direct neighbor, who purchased even earlier (also around 40% of what I paid), but their house is about 25% larger in square footage and lot size. Since it needs to be bench-marked, using last sale price causes way too much dispersion. This data is really helpful, but it does seem a little voyeuristic.

Copyability said:

grahamb said:

BK2SO said:

Ok. Did the calculations, and my property tax is $3000 more than it was last year! We have only lived in the house for 2 years, and the only major improvement made was to replace the shingles on the roof. WTF?

I see that someone is up $19k in 4 years....so it could be worse.




What I don't get is how the assessed value relates to market value. If a house just recently sold, I would have thought that the assessed value would match the recent sale. But I see some that are assessed for way under a recent sale, and some that are assessed way over a recent sale. Anyone have any insight there?

but then it would not be a fair comparison to the surrounding houses, on a relative basis. For example, my next door neighbor, whose house is very similar to mine, purchased their house in 1998, whereas I bought mine in 2014. based on the last sale price in the spreadsheet, they paid 40% of what I did (as I gasp for air). But we shouldn't have dissimilar tax levels for similar houses. Another example is my other direct neighbor, who purchased even earlier (also around 40% of what I paid), but their house is about 25% larger in square footage and lot size. Since it needs to be bench-marked, using last sale price causes way too much dispersion. This data is really helpful, but it does seem a little voyeuristic.

I'm only saying that I thought they used last sale price if it was very recent. Just like recent sales of neighboring homes becomes comperables for homes that haven't recently sold.

So if most went up %2.7 did that bring us back up to where we were before the last one went down or should it be a little less? I can't remember what % it went down but I think it was more than %2.7.

took the South Orange property tax reassessment information and plotted it onto a map. Pretty neat to see where there are pockets of tax increases and decreases. The color of the pins on the map correspond to the percentage property taxes are going up or down; blues and greens mean taxes are going down, and pinks and reds are where taxes are going up. Click on a pin to find out more info about a property. There are also filters in the top left so you can show/hide homes with certain attributes. It’s not perfect (pretty sure there’s no home in the middle of the duck pond), but let me know if you see any big issues.

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

Has anyone else *not* yet received the assessment card in the mail?

jimmurphy said:

Has anyone else *not* yet received the assessment card in the mail?

I have not.

grahamb said:

took the South Orange property tax reassessment information and plotted it onto a map. Pretty neat to see where there are pockets of tax increases and decreases. The color of the pins on the map correspond to the percentage property taxes are going up or down; blues and greens mean taxes are going down, and pinks and reds are where taxes are going up. Click on a pin to find out more info about a property. There are also filters in the top left so you can show/hide homes with certain attributes. It’s not perfect (pretty sure there’s no home in the middle of the duck pond), but let me know if you see any big issues.

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

That map is fantastic! And my taxes are down 13%, so I'm a happy taxpayer tonight.

.

The map is excellent. It jibes with Rob Sandow's post above, where he says that his review shows that traditionally lower priced neighborhoods have appreciated in value more than the average, due to demand for affordable houses, while traditionally higher priced neighborhoods have appreciated less than the average, due to high taxes, which depress sales prices.

grahamb said:

took the South Orange property tax reassessment information and plotted it onto a map. Pretty neat to see where there are pockets of tax increases and decreases. The color of the pins on the map correspond to the percentage property taxes are going up or down; blues and greens mean taxes are going down, and pinks and reds are where taxes are going up. Click on a pin to find out more info about a property. There are also filters in the top left so you can show/hide homes with certain attributes. It’s not perfect (pretty sure there’s no home in the middle of the duck pond), but let me know if you see any big issues.

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

Wow, that is great. Thanks.

Rob_Sandow said:

After spending about an hour looking through the spreadsheet that is available on the above link, it looks like there is a general trend where the traditionally lower priced neighborhoods have appreciated in value due to demand for affordable houses in South Orange, and will pay higher taxes as a result.

On the other hand, the traditionally higher priced neighborhoods have depreciated in value in comparison - in large part due to the huge legacy tax bills on those properties that depress sale prices, and will pay less. This is especially true on the extreme high end houses.

I have no skin in this game. I'm right in the middle, and my new assessment won't change my taxes in any significant way.

The CCR gave a presentation to the Board of Trustees in August about the changing demographics in the two towns. The CCR's concern is that because of the increase in house prices due to the demand for affordable houses, the towns are experiencing white inflight resulting in the loss of diversity, whereas the main reason for the founding of the CCR twenty years ago was to stop white flight and encourage both whites and African Americans to move to the two towns because of their diversity. The CCR presented several charts which it said would be posted on its website http://www.twotowns.org/ in several weeks but they have not been posted yet.

There will be a presentation by the CCR on Weds. Nov. 9, at the Maplewood library.

http://www.twotowns.org/

Nancy Gagnier's presentation to the BOT begins at 1:08:43:

http://view.earthchannel.com/PlayerController.aspx?&PGD=southorangenj&eID=98

The charts showed the demographics in each nieghborhood of the two towns. It was pointed out by the trustees that South Orange is integrated in all of its neighborhoods, whereas whites accounted for 95% of the residents in the western part of Maplewood. This is discussed in the video of the meeting.

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

Is there a map like this for Maplewood?

Copyability said:

grahamb said:

BK2SO said:

Ok. Did the calculations, and my property tax is $3000 more than it was last year! We have only lived in the house for 2 years, and the only major improvement made was to replace the shingles on the roof. WTF?

I see that someone is up $19k in 4 years....so it could be worse.




What I don't get is how the assessed value relates to market value. If a house just recently sold, I would have thought that the assessed value would match the recent sale. But I see some that are assessed for way under a recent sale, and some that are assessed way over a recent sale. Anyone have any insight there?

but then it would not be a fair comparison to the surrounding houses, on a relative basis. For example, my next door neighbor, whose house is very similar to mine, purchased their house in 1998, whereas I bought mine in 2014. based on the last sale price in the spreadsheet, they paid 40% of what I did (as I gasp for air). But we shouldn't have dissimilar tax levels for similar houses. Another example is my other direct neighbor, who purchased even earlier (also around 40% of what I paid), but their house is about 25% larger in square footage and lot size. Since it needs to be bench-marked, using last sale price causes way too much dispersion. This data is really helpful, but it does seem a little voyeuristic.

the sales price should be a benchmark if it sold recently....all other homes in the neighborhood should be benchmarked against that sales price.

jules867 said:

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

Is there a map like this for Maplewood?

Appraisal Systems hasn't posted Tax Impact files yet for Maplewood, as it has for South Orange.

Graham,

Really interesting chart and thanks for creating.

Out of curiosity, how did you manage to create it?

grahamb said:

took the South Orange property tax reassessment information and plotted it onto a map. Pretty neat to see where there are pockets of tax increases and decreases. The color of the pins on the map correspond to the percentage property taxes are going up or down; blues and greens mean taxes are going down, and pinks and reds are where taxes are going up. Click on a pin to find out more info about a property. There are also filters in the top left so you can show/hide homes with certain attributes. It’s not perfect (pretty sure there’s no home in the middle of the duck pond), but let me know if you see any big issues.

http://www.easymapmaker.com/map/southorangereval2016

way cool. thnx.

Thanks all.

newstead77 said:

Graham,

Really interesting chart and thanks for creating.


Out of curiosity, how did you manage to create it?

Thankfully, Appraisal Systems put much of the info in a pretty clean downloadable spreadsheet on their website. I had to format this a bit, calculate the taxes based on the assessments using the tax rates also found on their site, and set the groups and ranges for the filters (this was the most time consuming part). Then the map making website takes over and plots all the data on the map.

cramer said:

The map is excellent. It jibes with Rob Sandow's post above, where he says that his review shows that traditionally lower priced neighborhoods have appreciated in value more than the average, due to demand for affordable houses, while traditionally higher priced neighborhoods have appreciated less than the average, due to high taxes, which depress sales prices.

@cramer and @Rob_Sandow ,I'm seeing this in a different way. There seems to be a mass of green in the center and the pinks and reds seem to be more on the edges, particularly above Wyoming. If I'm judging this correctly, that goes with the traditional assessment that those homes are taxed higher based on location. What is surprising is how many homes are having their taxes lowered.

I think someone referred to new construction and I noticed a street with rather new construction completely raised and in case people do not know, new construction is always taxed heavier even with small lots.

If I were to try to spin this as a person who has had a real estate license for over 20 years, I might suggest that if you are planning on putting your house on the market in the very near future, potential buyers and even realtors do look at your assessed value and will use that to argue an offer that may be less than your price tag.

That said, if you are just settling in or have no intention of moving, the map makes compelling evidence.

I'm curious as to what percentage of homes are now valued at the number that they were before we were last lowered. The tax assessor had told me that they were all lowered proportionately.

And thank you @grahamb

Just had our inspection Friday here in Maplewood. After 2 appointment no-shows!