Serious Question: Is Trump a Nazi?

GL2 said:

I think there are many more who wouldn't admit to voting for Trump and I find that very unsettling. While I don't think Bernie could win, any credible mainstream democrat should've had a cakewalk this year.

Maybe, but Trump supporters seem to be very proud of supporting him.

Are there women married to Trump supporting men who are secretly Hillary supporters? Who knows.

Runner_Guy said:

algebra2 said:

You're his shrink now?

shoshannah said:

algebra2 said:

Trump's daughter and top adviser is married to a Jew. Pretty much disqualifies him from being a Nazi.

This is seriously wrong. Having a Jewish daughter and in-laws does not by default make someone more sympathetic to Jews or rule out any possibility of being a Nazi. Many Nazis turned on their own relatives and friends in Nazi Germany. And this statement especially would not apply DJT. He is not principled or thoughtful. I would venture to say he does not care about his children as individual souls with inner lives and convictions. He only cares about them to the extent that they serve his needs.

[...]
And I think the marriage of Donald's favorite child, Ivanka, to Jared Kushner and conversion to Judaism are relevant regarding Antisemitism.. Donald Trump actually has a good line about Ivanka's conversion. He has said "it wasn't part of the plan, but he was are very happy it happened." Would a Nazi say that?

You can't rest your laurels on something he says. So, he "said" that. He "says" a lot of things. Almost all of them lies.

He's not a Nazi.

shoshannah said:

Runner_Guy said:

algebra2 said:

You're his shrink now?

shoshannah said:

algebra2 said:

Trump's daughter and top adviser is married to a Jew. Pretty much disqualifies him from being a Nazi.

This is seriously wrong. Having a Jewish daughter and in-laws does not by default make someone more sympathetic to Jews or rule out any possibility of being a Nazi. Many Nazis turned on their own relatives and friends in Nazi Germany. And this statement especially would not apply DJT. He is not principled or thoughtful. I would venture to say he does not care about his children as individual souls with inner lives and convictions. He only cares about them to the extent that they serve his needs.

[...]
And I think the marriage of Donald's favorite child, Ivanka, to Jared Kushner and conversion to Judaism are relevant regarding Antisemitism.. Donald Trump actually has a good line about Ivanka's conversion. He has said "it wasn't part of the plan, but he was are very happy it happened." Would a Nazi say that?

You can't rest your laurels on something he says. So, he "said" that. He "says" a lot of things. Almost all of them lies.

GL2 said:

I think there are many more who wouldn't admit to voting for Trump and I find that very unsettling. While I don't think Bernie could win, any credible mainstream democrat should've had a cakewalk this year.

I would have enjoyed a Biden / Trump debate.

Trump is an example of the more disturbing type of leader we are seeing in many parts to the world today - the "cult of personality" leader. The only consistent trait Trump has exhibited over time is an interest in the advancement of Donald Trump without regard for the consequences of his actions. So, as Jesse Jackson one remarked that he would rather deal with a Southern racist than a Northern liberal, I would rather deal with a self-proclaimed Nazi than Donald Trump.

Runner_Guy said:

algebra2 said:

You're his shrink now?

shoshannah said:

algebra2 said:

Trump's daughter and top adviser is married to a Jew. Pretty much disqualifies him from being a Nazi.

This is seriously wrong. Having a Jewish daughter and in-laws does not by default make someone more sympathetic to Jews or rule out any possibility of being a Nazi. Many Nazis turned on their own relatives and friends in Nazi Germany. And this statement especially would not apply DJT. He is not principled or thoughtful. I would venture to say he does not care about his children as individual souls with inner lives and convictions. He only cares about them to the extent that they serve his needs.

Trump is racist, but I don't think that all racists should be considered Nazis. To call Trump a Nazi, when there are so many differences between Trumpism and Nazism, is an expansion of the definition of "Nazism" and declarification of the word that would make it a less meaningful.

To talk just of Antisemitism, Hitler and the Nazis had a kind of Antisemitism that hadn't existed even forty years previously, ie, a reading of history where Jews were hidden, central actors and were committed to the downfall of European civilization. Trump has never said anything like this.

Trumpism doesn't really have any articulated demonology of "cosmopolitans" and internationalists. I think he has accused the UN of being wasteful, but he doesn't claim that it's controlling the United States. Donald Trump's condemnations of finance (ie, Wall Street) are a lot less frequent than Sanders' and Clinton's.

Nazi Antisemitism was also part of a racial hierarchy, where "Aryan" whites were at the top and other groups filled in tiers below. Although Trump said "Mexico was sending drug dealers and rapists" to the US, Trump hasn't promoted the idea of a racial hierarchy. He has even defended race-based affirmative action.

And I think the marriage of Donald's favorite child, Ivanka, to Jared Kushner and conversion to Judaism are relevant regarding Antisemitism.. Donald Trump actually has a good line about Ivanka's conversion. He has said "it wasn't part of the plan, but he was are very happy it happened." Would a Nazi say that?

So call Donald Trump racist, call him xenophobic, call him a scumbag, but I don't think "Nazi" is accurate.

Good Post. Let's not water down words by using them to label other stuff we don't like.

terp said:

Runner_Guy said:

algebra2 said:

You're his shrink now?

shoshannah said:

algebra2 said:

Trump's daughter and top adviser is married to a Jew. Pretty much disqualifies him from being a Nazi.

This is seriously wrong. Having a Jewish daughter and in-laws does not by default make someone more sympathetic to Jews or rule out any possibility of being a Nazi. Many Nazis turned on their own relatives and friends in Nazi Germany. And this statement especially would not apply DJT. He is not principled or thoughtful. I would venture to say he does not care about his children as individual souls with inner lives and convictions. He only cares about them to the extent that they serve his needs.

Trump is racist, but I don't think that all racists should be considered Nazis. To call Trump a Nazi, when there are so many differences between Trumpism and Nazism, is an expansion of the definition of "Nazism" and declarification of the word that would make it a less meaningful.

To talk just of Antisemitism, Hitler and the Nazis had a kind of Antisemitism that hadn't existed even forty years previously, ie, a reading of history where Jews were hidden, central actors and were committed to the downfall of European civilization. Trump has never said anything like this.

Trumpism doesn't really have any articulated demonology of "cosmopolitans" and internationalists. I think he has accused the UN of being wasteful, but he doesn't claim that it's controlling the United States. Donald Trump's condemnations of finance (ie, Wall Street) are a lot less frequent than Sanders' and Clinton's.

Nazi Antisemitism was also part of a racial hierarchy, where "Aryan" whites were at the top and other groups filled in tiers below. Although Trump said "Mexico was sending drug dealers and rapists" to the US, Trump hasn't promoted the idea of a racial hierarchy. He has even defended race-based affirmative action.

And I think the marriage of Donald's favorite child, Ivanka, to Jared Kushner and conversion to Judaism are relevant regarding Antisemitism.. Donald Trump actually has a good line about Ivanka's conversion. He has said "it wasn't part of the plan, but he was are very happy it happened." Would a Nazi say that?

So call Donald Trump racist, call him xenophobic, call him a scumbag, but I don't think "Nazi" is accurate.

Good Post. Let's not water down words by using them to label other stuff we don't like.

Thank you..

I really don't like differentiating Trump from Nazis since by pointing out that Trump isn't as bad some people might think I'm saying "Trump is good," but something else that Nazism (and Italian Fascism) had in common was a "leader principle," ie, a contempt for democracy and a belief that power should be invested in a single person.

In Germany, Hitler was "Der Fuhrer," in Italy Mussolini was "Il Duce," in Spain Franco was "El Caudillo." Trumpists don't have an equivalent title for Trump. (Such a title isn't unknown in the US. Birchers called Robert Welch "the leader.")

I haven't heard Donald Trump express any contempt for Congress and the Supreme Court as institutions. I think Perot was more anti-Congress than Trump has been.

I know that somebody is going to bring up how Donald Trump said at the convention "Nobody knows the system better than me... [pause, gestures, smiles, smirks] which is why I alone can fix it," but I interpreted that to me "I alone [not Hillary] can fix it," not "I will fix it after I've wrecked Congress."

I also know that someone could say that Trumpism replaces Jews with Muslims as agents of wickedness, but again, I just don't see the equivalent. Trumpism doesn't accuse Muslims of cohesively acting to undermine and "degenerate" the United States, like Nazism accused Jews of doing to Germany. Trumpism has no animosity to Muslims on racial grounds. Trump said after the Paris attacks that some mosques should be closed (I suppose ones that were centers of radicalism) and that is disturbing and he despicably said that Jersey City Muslims celebrated on 9/11, but I don't think Trump's Islamophobia is equivalent to Nazi Antisemitism.

I think Trump should be compared historically not to Nazis, but to white backlash politicians of the 1960s and 1970s, like Frank Rizzo of Philadelphia, Anthony "Tough Tony" Imperiali of Newark, and George Wallace. Internationally, I think he could be compared to anti-immigrant, anti-globalization groups in Europe, like the UK Independence Party and the French National Front.

Donald Trump is racist. His birtherism, slander of Jersey City Muslims, and "Mexican Rapists comments convince me of that, but the Nazi comparison is unfair to Trump, historically declarifying, and minimizes the evil of the Nazi party.

Runner_Guy said:

terp said:

Runner_Guy said:

algebra2 said:

You're his shrink now?

shoshannah said:

algebra2 said:

Trump's daughter and top adviser is married to a Jew. Pretty much disqualifies him from being a Nazi.

This is seriously wrong. Having a Jewish daughter and in-laws does not by default make someone more sympathetic to Jews or rule out any possibility of being a Nazi. Many Nazis turned on their own relatives and friends in Nazi Germany. And this statement especially would not apply DJT. He is not principled or thoughtful. I would venture to say he does not care about his children as individual souls with inner lives and convictions. He only cares about them to the extent that they serve his needs.

Trump is racist, but I don't think that all racists should be considered Nazis. To call Trump a Nazi, when there are so many differences between Trumpism and Nazism, is an expansion of the definition of "Nazism" and declarification of the word that would make it a less meaningful.

To talk just of Antisemitism, Hitler and the Nazis had a kind of Antisemitism that hadn't existed even forty years previously, ie, a reading of history where Jews were hidden, central actors and were committed to the downfall of European civilization. Trump has never said anything like this.

Trumpism doesn't really have any articulated demonology of "cosmopolitans" and internationalists. I think he has accused the UN of being wasteful, but he doesn't claim that it's controlling the United States. Donald Trump's condemnations of finance (ie, Wall Street) are a lot less frequent than Sanders' and Clinton's.

Nazi Antisemitism was also part of a racial hierarchy, where "Aryan" whites were at the top and other groups filled in tiers below. Although Trump said "Mexico was sending drug dealers and rapists" to the US, Trump hasn't promoted the idea of a racial hierarchy. He has even defended race-based affirmative action.

And I think the marriage of Donald's favorite child, Ivanka, to Jared Kushner and conversion to Judaism are relevant regarding Antisemitism.. Donald Trump actually has a good line about Ivanka's conversion. He has said "it wasn't part of the plan, but he was are very happy it happened." Would a Nazi say that?

So call Donald Trump racist, call him xenophobic, call him a scumbag, but I don't think "Nazi" is accurate.

Good Post. Let's not water down words by using them to label other stuff we don't like.

Thank you..

I really don't like differentiating Trump from Nazis since by pointing out that Trump isn't as bad some people might think I'm saying "Trump is good," but something else that Nazism (and Italian Fascism) had in common was a "leader principle," ie, a contempt for democracy and a belief that power should be invested in a single person.

In Germany, Hitler was "Der Fuhrer," in Italy Mussolini was "Il Duce," in Spain Franco was "El Caudillo." Trumpists don't have an equivalent title for Trump. (Such a title isn't unknown in the US. Birchers called Robert Welch "the leader.")

I haven't heard Donald Trump express any contempt for Congress and the Supreme Court as institutions. I think Perot was more anti-Congress than Trump has been.


I know that somebody is going to bring up how Donald Trump said at the convention "Nobody knows the system better than me... [pause, gestures, smiles, smirks] which is why I alone can fix it," but I interpreted that to me "I alone [not Hillary] can fix it," not "I will fix it after I've wrecked Congress."

I also know that someone could say that Trumpism replaces Jews with Muslims as agents of wickedness, but again, I just don't see the equivalent. Trumpism doesn't accuse Muslims of cohesively acting to undermine and "degenerate" the United States, like Nazism accused Jews of doing to Germany. Trumpism has no animosity to Muslims on racial grounds. Trump said after the Paris attacks that some mosques should be closed (I suppose ones that were centers of radicalism) and that is disturbing and he despicably said that Jersey City Muslims celebrated on 9/11, but I don't think Trump's Islamophobia is equivalent to Nazi Antisemitism.

I think Trump should be compared historically not to Nazis, but to white backlash politicians of the 1960s and 1970s, like Frank Rizzo of Philadelphia, Anthony "Tough Tony" Imperiali of Newark, and George Wallace. Internationally, I think he could be compared to anti-immigrant, anti-globalization groups in Europe, like the UK Independence Party and the French National Front.

But the Nazi comparison is unfair to Trump, historically inaccurate, and minimizes the evil of the Nazi party.

2 in a row! I completely agree. Internationally, I think there are some real parallels to some of the groups you mention. I think there is an undercurrent that should not be dismissed. People do not like what is happening. They may not be able to articulate it well, and may not be able to put their finger on the cause. Here, Trump and Sanders have tapped into that a bit. We've also seen this trend internationally.

While I really don't like Trump, or agree w/ the agendas of some of International Groups, I think you ignore this trend at your peril. People are right to be angry. I just hope that we can take corrective action rather than destructive action.

If Clinton carries the election in November, and we continue down this current path, and the frustration continues to grow, the candidates in 2020 might be really really interesting.

Trump embraces the Führerprinzip. It doesn't make him a Nazi, but it is disturbing, to say the least.

from: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/07/trump-rnc-speech-alone-fix-it/492557/

In 2016, Donald J. Trump mounted the stage, and told America that the nation is in crisis. That attacks on police and terrorism threaten the American way of life. That the United States suffers from domestic disaster, and international humiliation. That it is full of shuttered factories and crushed communities. That it is beset by “poverty and violence at home” and “war and destruction abroad.”
And he offered them a solution.

I am your voice, said Trump. I alone can fix it. I will restore law and order. He did not appeal to prayer, or to God. He did not ask Americans to measure him against their values, or to hold him responsible for living up to them. He did not ask for their help. He asked them to place their faith in him.

Interviewer: What do you believe is behind this recent increase in terrorist bombings?

Mr. Helpmann: Bad sportsmanship. A ruthless minority of people seems to have forgotten certain good old-fashioned virtues. They just can't stand seeing the other fellow win. If these people would just play the game, they'd get a lot more out of life.

Interviewer: Nevertheless, Mr. Helpmann, there are those who maintain that the Ministry of Information has become too large and unwieldy...And the cost of it all, Deputy Minister? Seven percent of the gross national product.

Mr. Helpmann: I understand this concern on behalf of the tax payers. People want value for money. That's why we always insist on the principle of Information Retrieval charges. It's absolutely right and fair that those found guilty should pay for their periods of detention and for the Information Retrieval Procedures used in their interrogation.

Interviewer: Do you believe that the government is winning the battle against terrorists?

Mr. Helpmann: Oh, yes. Our morale is much higher than theirs. We're fielding all their strokes, running a lot of them out, and pretty consistently knocking them for six. I'd say they're nearly out of the game. Why should decent law-abiding citizens have to subsidize criminals?

Interviewer: But Mr. Helpmann, the bombing campaign is now in its thirteenth year.

Mr. Helpmann: Beginner's luck.

Listen, kid, we're all in it together.

Not necessarily a Nazi but definitely a putz

More insulting than his candidacy will be the reward he reaps after this sihtshow is over.

theres thismuch difference between trump the racist and trump the man who recruits and understands the lingo of the white supremecists who support him, the trump who moves in circles that are not privy to you or me, where the clues to his personal beliefs leak out from junior trumps mouth and on his twitter feed.

some of you want the word Nazi to only belong to history, but its here in America well hidden and out of the mainstream, until trump.

https://www.splcenter.org/hate-map

GL2 said:

More insulting than his candidacy will be the reward he reaps after this sihtshow is over.

Well, I'm counting on the short attention span of the public. Will he get a talk show on The Blaze, (which seems to have disappeared from my cable line up)? Will he want to keep up with a daily format? Will he be viewed as the champion of the working man after he "loses to a girl" to borrow a phrase from Elizabeth Warren?

Isn't the average person saying "Sarah who?" (Even Trump dropped her quickly.)

Will Hannity, O'Reilly and Judge Jeanine be chatting him up when he can't boost ratings?

Or will he have to wear the scarlet letter L for loser?

Hey, maybe the whole clan are white supremacists:

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/09/trump-jrs-skittles-tweet-is-based-on-two-different-white-supremacist-memes/

Morganna said:

GL2 said:

More insulting than his candidacy will be the reward he reaps after this sihtshow is over.

Well, I'm counting on the short attention span of the public. Will he get a talk show on The Blaze, (which seems to have disappeared from my cable line up)? Will he want to keep up with a daily format? Will he be viewed as the champion of the working man after he "loses to a girl" to borrow a phrase from Elizabeth Warren?

Isn't the average person saying "Sarah who?" (Even Trump dropped her quickly.)

Will Hannity, O'Reilly and Judge Jeanine be chatting him up when he can't boost ratings?

Or will he have to wear the scarlet letter L for loser?

Well, his constituents surely can't afford to patronize his many resorts and hotels; and those who can afford it might be embarrassed to patronize them or maybe folks will boycott his businesses.

While I don't think Trump has the ability to focus on such stuff, his alliance with Ailes and Bannon smells like a major media project to many people.

GL2 said:

Morganna said:

GL2 said:

More insulting than his candidacy will be the reward he reaps after this sihtshow is over.

Well, I'm counting on the short attention span of the public. Will he get a talk show on The Blaze, (which seems to have disappeared from my cable line up)? Will he want to keep up with a daily format? Will he be viewed as the champion of the working man after he "loses to a girl" to borrow a phrase from Elizabeth Warren?

Isn't the average person saying "Sarah who?" (Even Trump dropped her quickly.)

Will Hannity, O'Reilly and Judge Jeanine be chatting him up when he can't boost ratings?

Or will he have to wear the scarlet letter L for loser?

Well, his constituents surely can't afford to patronize his many resorts and hotels; and those who can afford it might be embarrassed to patronize them or maybe folks will boycott his businesses.

While I don't think Trump has the ability to focus on such stuff, his alliance with Ailes and Bannon smells like a major media project to many people.

Patronize much? Last I checked, HRC's lead over Trump has dwindled.

Last I checked she'd recovered what she'd lost.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/data-points/hillary-clinton-regains-momentum-against-donald-trump-poll-n650926

And yes, I do. I'm tired of the "poor white disenfranchised unemployed" people who lionize this fascist. No coal job? Look for another. No work for folks like me? Retrain. Stop whining and falling for the bullsiht about immigrants and minorities "stealing" your jobs.

And republicans? They're more responsible for Trump than Trump. Their small party will only get smaller until they stop embracing the hate.

GL2 said:

Last I checked she'd recovered what she'd lost.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/data-points/hillary-clinton-regains-momentum-against-donald-trump-poll-n650926

When Nate Silver says she has recovered, she has recovered.

GL2 said:

And yes, I do. I'm tired of the "poor white disenfranchised unemployed" people who lionize this fascist. No coal job? Look for another. No work for folks like me? Retrain. Stop whining and falling for the bullsiht about immigrants and minorities "stealing" your jobs.

Well, that will make them see the light. No question about it.

GL2 said:

And republicans? They're more responsible for Trump than Trump. Their small party will only get smaller until they stop embracing the hate.

Unfortunately, given that most House races in this country are basically uncontested for one party or the other, there is no incentive for moderation.

algebra2 said:

He's not a Nazi.

Great qualification for being POTUS.

Runner_Guy said:

I really don't like differentiating Trump from Nazis since by pointing out that Trump isn't as bad some people might think I'm saying "Trump is good," but something else that Nazism (and Italian Fascism) had in common was a "leader principle," ie, a contempt for democracy and a belief that power should be invested in a single person.

In Germany, Hitler was "Der Fuhrer," in Italy Mussolini was "Il Duce," in Spain Franco was "El Caudillo." Trumpists don't have an equivalent title for Trump. (Such a title isn't unknown in the US. Birchers called Robert Welch "the leader.")

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/united-states/2016-05-12/american-caudillo

No but insisting he's a Nazi, isn't right..

LOST said:

algebra2 said:

He's not a Nazi.

Great qualification for being POTUS.

LOST said:

algebra2 said:

He's not a Nazi.

Great qualification for being POTUS.

I believe we've lowered the bar a bit this time around.

.

That was quick.

LOST said:

algebra2 said:

He's not a Nazi.

Great qualification for being POTUS.

The bar is so low that it's resting on the floor. Soon to be in the sub-basement.