Maplewood Town Hall Flag is Far Too Small for the Flag Pole

tomcat

In the service (in Europe), I was taught that a flag should be sized to the height of the flag pole, based on flag diagonal = 1/3 the height of the flag pole.  This was for a national flag with 28:37 height/length ratio (= 1.321 ratio)

The current US flag has 10:19 side x length ratio (per Presidential decree).  I couldn't find an official pole to flag recommendation, but on the web site of Gettysburg Flag, I find a recommendation that flag length be 1/4 of the pole height.  Obviously, the current flag at Maplewood Town Hall comes nowhere near this recommendation.

I can't tell exactly how tall the flag pole is, but I am estimating that it is in the 40' to 50' range.  Here are the appropriate flag dimensions for poles in that range:


ml1

maybe we should shorten the flagpole 


tomcat

Don't get me wrong.  I am not advocating a ridiculous flag ala Autoland on Rte 22, just something in proportion to the facilities (pole height and Town Hall).

I am aware that the current flag was donated.  However, it should be displayed at a location, where the size is appropriate.



chalmers

The one in downtown Berkeley Heights kinda takes the cake.



tomcat

Agreed.  Far too large for the pole.  

When displayed at 'half', it is either dragging on the ground or barely off the top.


quercus

Did you let the town know?


tomcat

I mentioned it to one of the TC members during the Memorial Day ceremony in 2018.  As is obvious, nothing has happened.

After 12 months, I thought it necessary to bring this to the attention of a wider group. 



mrincredible

We'll, um...

We'll get right on it.


ridski

Who's up for starting a petition and a gofundme page?


bella

How about you donate one since you seem to be the only one person with an objection to the current flag.


yahooyahoo

You know what they say, the bigger the flagpole.....


mrincredible

Okay, all kidding aside, here's what I've learned about talking to people.

If you approached a TC member during the Memorial Day events a year ago and mentioned that the town hall flag was improperly sized for the flagpole I would give them about a 0.05% chance of even remembering that conversation. They no doubt had a hundred different conversations that day, many of which were likely people telling them something wrong about town.  And they had some responsibilities at the official events.  

The human brain is not equipped to process and retain that much information, especially under the conditions at the time, and your concern about the size of the flag probably didn't trigger the creation of a memory.

Escalating to a post to MOL probably will have about as much effect, but an email to the township administrator might generate a response. Her contact information is on this page: https://www.twp.maplewood.nj.us/administration

For what it's worth, I think it's a reasonable thing to bring up. Flag etiquette isn't trivial, especially in the context of a government building.


joan_crystal

I just received the following email providing background on this. The author is Past Post Commander of VFW Post 10120. He has since moved out of the area. I can verify the facts presented since Bernie was directly involved in this.  Edits in [ ] are mine and made for clarity.

" Joan someone wrote in [MOL] about the flag [on the flagpole at Town Hall] being too small for the flag pole, I remember we at the VFW Post 10120 purchased a large flag for that pole over 5 or 6 years ago but [town staff] somehow misplaced it. I talked to one of the [DPW] workers years ago and he said it was too large of a flag for one person to put up. So that's what I know of the flag that we purchased and Bernie [Crystal] ordered it for us,that's how far back it was. Maybe you can set the record straight on this.    Regards, Frank Warzocha"



yahooyahoo

That's a good point, a very large flag would take two people to put up and take down to avoid touching the ground.


Klinker
yahooyahoo said:
That's a good point, a very large flag would take two people to put up and take down to avoid touching the ground.

 Doesn't it take two people to properly fold any flag that is larger than a postage stamp?  My job as a teen ager involved raising and lowering the flag at our town's public library and we always needed two people to fold it.

That said, the issue of the town's flag size really is way, WAY down on my list of priorities.  Trump has so desecrated our flag and all of our other national symbols, perhaps it is best to make it small so that it can hide its shame.


BG9

I wonder how many countries have such flag etiquette  as we do. Its a almost like a religion. 

China may not have length vs. height rule. It seems the ratio on their preeminent flag at Tiananmen Square is about 6 or 7 to 1.


tomcat
joan_crystal said:
I just received the following email providing background on this. The author is Past Post Commander of VFW Post 10120. He has since moved out of the area. I can verify the facts presented since Bernie was directly involved in this.  Edits in [ ] are mine and made for clarity.
" Joan someone wrote in [MOL] about the flag [on the flagpole at Town Hall] being too small for the flag pole, I remember we at the VFW Post 10120 purchased a large flag for that pole over 5 or 6 years ago but [town staff] somehow misplaced it. I talked to one of the [DPW] workers years ago and he said it was too large of a flag for one person to put up. So that's what I know of the flag that we purchased and Bernie [Crystal] ordered it for us,that's how far back it was. Maybe you can set the record straight on this.    Regards, Frank Warzocha"


 Joan,

This does not surprise me.  Employee 'convenience' over insult to the flag.

On top of that, it is a non issue, since an illuminated flag does not have to come down at sunset, so there is no need to take it down every night (as I had to do in the service).

Anyway, I have emailed the town administrator per suggestion from mrincredible.


joan_crystal

My guess is that the "two person" comment was an excuse for the flag going missing; but, I have nothing to support that supposition.


dave
BG9 said:
I wonder how many countries have such flag etiquette  as we do. Its a almost like a religion. 
China may not have length vs. height rule. It seems the ratio on their preeminent flag at Tiananmen Square is about 6 or 7 to 1.

They brought in a feng shui master for the perfect ratio.


nohero

Not to quibble (okay, so it is a quibble).  I don't think this is a formal "flag etiquette" issue.  It's more of an aesthetic or "how it looks" issue.  So Mr. D. Ross is closer to the point with his comment.

dave said:
They brought in a feng shui master for the perfect ratio.

 




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