Is religion finally dying?

imonlysleeping said:

What does it mean to be "spiritual" but not religious? That you believe in spirits? I've never understood what people mean when they say this. 

 When I use the term I mean that I am not part of any particular institutional religion or Church. I believe in a higher power as well as in (normal) Christian teachings. But I also learn from Buddhism, Hinduism and metaphysical teachings. I can only really speak for my self. But I believe most "spiritual" people are not affiliated with any institutional church.

Lost said:

Why are you out if Francis is in?

Because I am spiritual, not religious.

SBNR.

Thanks batman. Yes I am. 

Msgr. Sheen ...

“As all men are touched by God’s love, so all are also touched by the desire for His intimacy. No one escapes this longing; we are all kings in exile, miserable without the Infinite. Those who reject the grace of God have a desire to avoid God, as those who accept it have a desire for God. 

The modern atheist does not disbelieve because of his intellect, but because of his will; it is not knowledge that makes him an atheist…The denial of God springs from a man’s desire not to have a God—from his wish that there were no Justice behind the universe, so that his injustices would fear not retribution; from his desire that there be no Law, so that he may not be judged by it; from his wish that there were no Absolute Goodness, that he might go on sinning with impunity. 

That is why the modern atheist is always angered when he hears anything said about God and religion—he would be incapable of such a resentment if God were only a myth. His feeling toward God is the same as that which a wicked man has for one whom he has wronged: he wishes he were dead so that he could do nothing to avenge the wrong. The betrayer of friendship knows his friend exists, but he wished he did not; the post-Christian atheist knows God exists, but he desires He should not.” 
― Fulton J. Sheen, Peace of Soul: Timeless Wisdom on Finding Serenity and Joy by the Century's Most Acclaimed Catholic Bishop

@mtierney - your post is not only misguided, but offensive.

Hey wait a minute. I believe there are many humans walking this earth that are not angered and resentful. That was a pompous statement to make by Msgr Sheen. I much prefer how pope Francis expresses himself.

Pope Francis quote deleted as it was inaccurate

Please - pope francis also expresses that people who are married who don't have children are selfish. He's no better than any religious leader who thinks he owns the rights to morality. Don't hold him to any high standard.

I'm not an angry atheist. There is a CONSTANT assumption that atheists are "angry" and in some sort of denial. I guess I'm sort of sick of the ignorance.

Fair enough, and thank you for explaining; but there is another tendency on the secular side that the only good religious person is one who doesn't speak. Both that tendency and the one that you describe on the part of religious people do little for mutual understanding, which may well be impossible in the end; but such attitudes would close the door before anyone can say anything at all.

TigerLilly said:

Please - pope francis also expresses that people who are married who don't have children are selfish. He's no better than any religious leader who thinks he owns the rights to morality. Don't hold him to any high standard.e

 Well I don't really. Yet there is just something about that man that fulfills in me at times, what I like about my spirituality. I never saw the married and no children comment. Yet I believe he said it as you say. That too was a pompous statement. The thing is my Irish catholic mom already taught me to listen with a discerning ear. I can take what I agree with and let the rest go. My relationship with God and my spirit is solid.

SouthernBaron said:

Fair enough, and thank you for explaining; but there is another tendency on the secular side that the only good religious person is one who doesn't speak. Both that tendency and the one that you describe on the part of religious people do little for mutual understanding, which may well be impossible in the end; but such attitudes would close the door before anyone can say anything at all.

Religious people tend to speak their beliefs. Atheists tend to not speak at all because they are aware of others "attitudes" toward them.

I'm not offended by delusional ranting with no basis in fact, so- it's all good.

marcsiry said:

I'm not offended by delusional ranting with no basis in fact, so- it's all good.

 Hah! That truth goes both ways. As a mother of a very intelligent atheist, I should know. I love how he only sees the world through his eyes. It fascinates me how he is at such peace with this perspective. Yet it is more than enough for him. He recently was diagnosed with multiple myeloma, has gone through chemo and a bone marrow transplant. He now is back to enjoying his wife, 4 children and recently pitched 2 innings with his baseball team in Central Park. He is so full of life and that is all he needs. He loves that my sisters and I pray for him because he knows it makes us happy to do so. We coexist very compatibly.

marcsiry said:

I'm not offended by delusional ranting with no basis in fact, so- it's all good.

 I'm not the fragile type, but find the massive delusions about me offensive..perhaps that makes me a weak person, but I'll accept that.

oneofthegirls said:

TigerLilly said:

Please - pope francis also expresses that people who are married who don't have children are selfish. He's no better than any religious leader who thinks he owns the rights to morality. Don't hold him to any high standard.e

 Well I don't really. Yet there is just something about that man that fulfills in me at times, what I like about my spirituality. I never saw the married and no children comment. Yet I believe he said it as you say. That too was a pompous statement. The thing is my Irish catholic mom already taught me to listen with a discerning ear. I can take what I agree with and let the rest go. My relationship with God and my spirit is solid.

 He is the leader of a church. He is the best PR the Catholic church has because he lulls people with what he says while the church itself can keep on doing something else. There's no accountability. None. The church keeps doing what they do while hiding behind his distractions.

For what it's worth, Pope Francis never made the comments on that quote.

As far as the Sheen quote, it is offensive, because it implies that an atheist is a rejection of wanting to uphold a moral code - to 'sin with impunity'.

This shows how little he, and many religious people have looked into serious atheist philosophies. All people I know closely that identify as a non-believer have strong moral convictions and generally follow them more closely than most religious people I know.

 Maybe Mister Sheen should spend a little more time investigating, and he might find that there is no need to have a belief in a higher power to be a moral person. If you're only not 'sinning' due to fear of retribution, the existentially you're essentially still a child. 

B.S. @qrysdonnell

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2015/02/12/married-and-dont-want-kids-pope-francis-says-your-selfish/

But...but...but...you are TIGER lily. If you are seeing massive delusions you need to hang out a little more worth at least ridski. He won't take ANY of that crap. Aetheists are cool. Individuals with their own frame of reference.

Don't ever believe otherwise.

What's more impressive- a person who is and does good because they've made it their choice, or someone who behaves because they "fear" an all-seeing, all-knowing invisible being that will punish them? That's why I find the Sheen quote to be delusional.

ETA: qrysdonnell pretty much covered this in his last paragraph while I was typing in another window.

@qrysdonnell - apologies, as you may have been responding to someone else

I have no idea what you are saying oneofthegirls

What I would term "offensive" is, as SouthernBaron gently noted, the tone set by the OP.

mtierney said:

What I would term "offensive" is, as SouthernBaron gently noted, the tone set by the OP.

Or....what you posted.

TigerLilly said:

I have no idea what you are saying oneofthegirls

 I am trying to say my son is comfortable with his aethism and doesn't find his mom and aunts offensive.  And we don't find his aethism offensive either.

TigerLilly said:

@qrysdonnell - apologies, as you may have been responding to someone else

 No worries. It was actually the quote about not having to believe in God which was posted as a 'picture quote'.

And here's the Snopes reference about its veracity.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/popeatheist.asp

There have actually been a lot of instances with Francis of fake liberal leaning quotes getting attributed to him, which has helped his popularity. 

qrysdonnell said:

TigerLilly said:

@qrysdonnell - apologies, as you may have been responding to someone else

 No worries. It was actually the quote about not having to believe in God which was posted as a 'picture quote'.

And here's the Snopes reference about its veracity.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/popeatheist.asp

There have actually been a lot of instances with Francis of fake liberal leaning quotes getting attributed to him, which has helped his popularity. 

 My bad.e

TigerLilly said:

@oneofthegirls 
What makes you think I'm uncomfortable with being an atheist? I'm very comfortable with that. It's other people's ignorance about me that I have an issue with.q

 I get that now. Sorry for the misunderstanding.