Meanderings...

There are protein drinks that are vegan.

Yep, they'll work. If he'll trust the certification. ;-)

Man, if I were undergoing radical surgery like that and then going on a severely calorie restricted diet the last thing I'd want to be recovering on is packaged food-like products.

Fresh squeezed fruit and veg juice, homemade soup broth, homemade nut milks, maybe a little slurry oatmeal, maybe some quality kefir/yogurt would fit the bill.

Take care of yourself, eat natural and healthy, and stop trying to disprove the benefits of such. The organic/macrobiotic/vegan/hipsters by and large aren't the ones getting bypass surgery.

There, I said it.

drummerboy said:

But the good ones are really entertaining and move along with a quick rhythm. They're much better than most sitcoms that are out there today. Or maybe I'm just weird.

...but so is a root canal!

Sundays said:

Man, if I were undergoing radical surgery like that and then going on a severely calorie restricted diet the last thing I'd want to be recovering on is packaged food-like products.

Fresh squeezed fruit and veg juice, homemade soup broth, homemade nut milks, maybe a little slurry oatmeal, maybe some quality kefir/yogurt would fit the bill.

Take care of yourself, eat natural and healthy, and stop trying to disprove the benefits of such. The organic/macrobiotic/vegan/hipsters by and large aren't the ones getting bypass surgery.

There, I said it.

Thanks for your concern. I think I may be misunderstood in my anti-woo crusades. I'm not against eating whole foods over processed foods. Of course I understand the benefits of doing that. You'd be quite surprised at how few processed foods and how little junk I eat. The causes of obesity are more complicated than what we used to think, as we are increasingly finding out the more we study it.

What I'm against are people promoting benefits of certain foods/supplements/regimens/what-have-you when there is little to no scientific basis for claiming such. There's no clear benefit to organics, so I call b.s. on that. There's no clear benefit to most supplements so I call b.s. on that. Most people don't have gluten sensitivity, regardless if they think they do, so I call b.s. on that. Acupuncture has been shown time and time and time again to work no better than placebo - b.s. on that. And so on and so on. I don't choose my targets out of thin air.

On the other hand, for example, it's pretty clear that diets that rely less on meat are more healthy. Study after study confirm this. No b.s. on vegetarianism from me.

As for my recovery diet, I'm not planning on any "packaged food-like products", except for maybe sugar-free ice-pops, which seem to be a popular thing to get through the first month drudgery. During recovery, getting adequate protein is important (especially considering we're only getting 600-1000 calories a day) and many doctors recommend the use of some kind of protein supplement to make sure you get your quota. While it might not be ideal in terms of naturalness, as a short-term solution it's probably no big deal. The supplements run the gamut from some true junk to some fairly straightforward protein extracts that you mix up yourself. Again, I await my surgeon's recommendations on this.

DB, I respect your "crusade" against woo. I'll even go so far as to say I learn from it.

I, however, also think the mind is a powerful tool, and as such placebo is waaay underutilized. If prayer/homeopathy/acupuncture/gluten-free/etc are means to adavance the placebo effect, I think they're probably money and effort well spent.

And yes, my comment was meant with love and concern. Treat yourself well. Don't go into this on the tail end of a binge. A lot of foods are addictive, try to break the cycle early in the game for the best chance of long term success. Get used to healthy eating as soon as you can.

I'm preaching and generalizing. It's not purely directed at you. I don't know how you eat. I hope you'll eat as well as possible. Rooting for the best possible success for you. Positive hippie vibes are coming your way!

I've actually given considerable thought to how much it's necessary to try and re-learn eating habits before the surgery. I don't know if I'm just rationalizing, but I'm thinking it's not that necessary for success because of the different anatomy post-surgery. Between the smaller stomach size and the reduction in ghrelin hormone, you're forced into a habit change for the short term. True, you do have to make smart food choices regardless - that will still be up to me, but I'm counting on the fact that I've decided to alter my anatomy as the incentive to get me to make those choices.

I raised the question in one of the support groups and asked how many people tried to change habits pre-surgery, and very few people had, and they were all having success post-surgery. I don't, however, know what it means for long term success. I will say that the nutritionist that I'm working with, who seems pretty on the ball, is not stressing making any major dietary changes pre-surgery. I know it seems counter-intuitive. While I'm not making any major changes right now, I do think I'm mentally preparing myself, because it's about all I think of.

In a different tone on a related matter, a friend here is about to undergo some radical restructuring of her colon. She's already slim, this is not for weight management; she has an autoimmune condition which unfortunately attacks her digestive system and this will be her second such surgery. She was told at the beginning of the year that it was critical for her to have the surgery, and every time her date has approached, she's been rescheduled: now she's one week pre-op and was just notified she been postponed for another 3weeks.

She's tired mentally and physically of keeping fit for this, and watching her diet (in her case, her tolerance has decreased sharply). Her easygoing nature is adversely affected. She had just bought some expensive concert tickets for Christmas that she now can't use. In fact, her Christmas is impacted by being so close to recovery...

And she feels guilty for being resentful of the cancer patients who keep bumping her out of the queue.

DB, I hope nothing presents that will change your plans, unless it's for the better. Steeling yourself for the life change is hard enough, extending the wait is harder.

yeah, thanks. It's already been frustrating waiting these 6 months imposed by the insurance company for apparently no reason. My surgeon does nothing but weight loss surgeries, so there won't be anyone bumping me out of the queue, I don't think. I'm trying to re-schedule it for 1 week later, only so that I can have the surgery when my son is back home from school, but I told them 1 week is all I was willing to delay it - if the next date available was going to go into January, I'd just as soon have it on the 11th with my son at school and I'll take my chances.

I really don't understand the 'common sense' of the insurance companies. To me, it's like they're trying to fix the outcome of a bet. And not in our favour but always theirs.
Am glad it's one type of surgery in the practice...and that flexibility will go in your favour.

Not all insurance companies require the waiting period. Apparently mine is one of the last. But then again, a lot of companies don't cover the surgery at all, so I can't complain too much. Such are the vagaries of the US health care system. From my forum reading I've found that many people go to Mexico for their surgery, where the cost is only about $4000 complete. I don't think 4k would cover the cost of the anesthesiologist here in the states. (I might be exaggerating.) I've heard US costs go from 20k to 100k, though that could vary depending on the complexity of the surgery, I guess, but that's still pretty crazy.

=========================================================

Well, I don't need much of an excuse to buy a new kitchen gadget, so I just went to Costco and bought a Ninja blender and am going to try and make some of those green smoothies that look so unappetizing. ;-) Bought a bag of mixed "super greens" to throw in (kale, spinach, some other stuff), and a bag of frozen berries, so I think I'm all set.

drummerboy said:

Not all insurance companies require the waiting period. Apparently mine is one of the last. But then again, a lot of companies don't cover the surgery at all, so I can't complain too much. Such are the vagaries of the US health care system. From my forum reading I've found that many people go to Mexico for their surgery, where the cost is only about $4000 complete. I don't think 4k would cover the cost of the anesthesiologist here in the states. (I might be exaggerating.) I've heard US costs go from 20k to 100k, though that could vary depending on the complexity of the surgery, I guess, but that's still pretty crazy.

=========================================================

Well, I don't need much of an excuse to buy a new kitchen gadget, so I just went to Costco and bought a Ninja blender and am going to try and make some of those green smoothies that look so unappetizing. ;-) Bought a bag of mixed "super greens" to throw in (kale, spinach, some other stuff), and a bag of frozen berries, so I think I'm all set.

You need a frozen banana to make that smoothy creamy and delicious.

Noted. No bananas in casa DB at the moment. If I use a frozen banana and frozen berries I guess I can skip putting ice in it? Or do I need some kind of liquid to smooth it up?

I guess I should find a recipe or 7. I betcha there are some on the toobz.

uh oh. I'm entering woo land....
;-)

drummerboy said:

Noted. No bananas in casa DB at the moment. If I use a frozen banana and frozen berries I guess I can skip putting ice in it? Or do I need some kind of liquid to smooth it up?

I guess I should find a recipe or 7. I betcha there are some on the toobz.

It usually requires a bit of liquid. I use almond milk just because I can't drink regular dairy and this is my preference for smoothies. Some people like coconut water. Anyway, whatever floats your boat will be fine, including regular milk or yogurt.

drummerboy said:

uh oh. I'm entering woo land....
;-)

ah good, i see my positive hippie vibes were received in good order. ;-)

i'm gonna make a banana, apple, yogurt, almond milk, whey protein shake right now in your honor!

btw, costco has good vanilla extract and cinnamon powder, which are nice shake additions.

Ah, if you are into smoothies, there are some wonderful recipe books out there so you wouldn't get bored having the same stuff day after day. AND if you use frozen fruit, not only is it easier to keep around for more than a few days, but also the ice has the lovely added benefit of making the smoothy more frothy, for some reason. And the whole thing is colder, usually a good thing. I don't understand the physics of the foam, but I've noticed it seems to be consistently true for me.

Sundays said:

drummerboy said:

uh oh. I'm entering woo land....
;-)

ah good, i see my positive hippie vibes were received in good order. ;-)

i'm gonna make a banana, apple, yogurt, almond milk, whey protein shake right now in your honor!

btw, costco has good vanilla extract and cinnamon powder, which are nice shake additions.

I actually have both of those, from Costco, sitting on my shelf.

I just opened this thread,DB, and want to wish you all the best with the forthcoming surgery.

One side effect I hear is a penchant to become a conservative

Then I'm out.

Wishing you good luck but hope you don't need it...be well!!!

thanks!

Meanwhile, I recently discovered the Summit Farmer's Market, and I have fallen in love with the wares of the chick pea lady (I'm sure she has a more formal name). Bought a squash lasagna which looks delicious. Plus I had a breakfast pizza from the wood-fired pizza guy which was freaking delicious.

It's a good thing they close soon, because I spend w-a-a-a-y too much money there.

Still working on clearing counter space to set up the Ninja.

PeggyC said:

There is a faint greenish tint to pistachios when they are still in the shell, but it's NOTHING like the color you get with things that are "pistachio-flavored." Horrible stuff. As for the walnut... I got nothin'.

Returning to this earlier topic ... I just read a National Geographic article about the pistachio industry in Turkey (which has phenomenally good pistachios; something I learned during a trip there many years ago), and here's a mention of the green coloring.

http://outofedenwalk.nationalgeographic.com/2014/10/27/pistachio-mafia/

Turkey grows some of the finest pistachio nuts in the world. It is a point of national pride. After all, the classic Turkish dessert, baklava, is nothing without ground pistachios. The nut is baked into every slice of this distinctive, crisp pastry drenched in honey, in syrup. Pistachio powder—so bright green as to look artificially dyed (but it is not)—is the core natural ingredient of this sweet.

well, I'll be...
mystery solved...
behold - pistachio paste!

OK. This waking up at 3 AM shyte is nonsense.

Welcome to MY world...

The ninja has been setup, finally, but haven't made a smoothie yet. I did make a sweet potato latte though. It was quite delicious, but I'm a sucker for sweet potatoes. I'm still wary of drinking my spinach.

This ninja setup may be a wee bit more blender than I'll ever need in my life though. It comes with a single serving blade, a bigger blade for the larger container, and food processor type blade with a food processor type bowl. And that bigger blade is a monster - about 6 inches tall at least. It's scary looking. See pic below.

My hankering for corn dogs has been met, albeit unsatisfactorily. Neither the Shoprite or the Trader Joe's variety were particularly tasty. Both were kind of bland - maybe because they were turkey dogs. Anyway, that's out of my system.

drummerboy said:

uh oh. I'm entering woo land....
;-)

) Yeah, but not all supplements/meal replacements are woo. Some are just that.