Hillary Clinton

ml1 said:

ridski said:

I await your further questions.

Perfect! A picture of a late night comedian to represent Ridski.

BCC said:

'I don't think', 'It's impossible to tell', 'probably',

I was counting on you, but how am I to make up my mind when you can't make up yours.

You asked for further questions – how about this:

It has been agreed some unforeseen event could turn the the election on it's head overnight.

Hmmm, criticize someone for not making up their mind and then fall back on passive construction to make a point.

BCC said:

'I don't think', 'It's impossible to tell', 'probably',

I was counting on you, but how am I to make up my mind when you can't make up yours.

You asked for further questions – how about this:

It has been agreed some unforeseen event could turn the the election on it's head overnight.

Even with your crystal ball, you can't see it, - because if you can see it, how can it be unforeseen?

Since that's the case how can you help me make up my mind if you can't tell me what that important
unforeseen event will be ?

Further, except for you and one or two others, no one seems to care why I choose to wait to see what happens.Why would they, and why do you?

1. So many things are unforeseen... Until they happen. Then in hindsight we analyse those events and the event chains which led up to them and ask ourselves "How did we not foresee this?" Sure, there will be someone out there who claims they foresaw it, and they'll say that no one listened. They'll point to their blogs and yell "See! The signs were there all along!" But we'll be dumbfounded how it could have happened, and we'll call for the resignations of those who should have noticed the red flags or forgot to report the tiniest details which could have prevented the event. There's not much which can be done in the end except to be stalwart and accept that we are humans and we make mistakes and miss things which should have been noticed. That is, of course, if these events are "Acts of God" or natural events. 

If there's an unforeseen event designed by another person, then it's not unforeseen at all, it's planned, and the extent to which a plan works or fails is based on how well the planners are able to cope with unforeseen events, too.

2. I cannot. And it's not my job to do so. I know that you have actually made some decisions already, so you're not really just waiting and seeing. I know you're not voting for Clinton or Trump. I doubt you'll vote for Gary Johnson as he believes that labor unions hurt the economy and wants to cut US aid to Israel, and has stated that he would not follow them into a war that they had started. And you won't vote for Jill Stein as she supports BDS, and has similar policies regarding Israel. Under those circumstances, I would advise staying at home. 

However, we're looking at an unforeseen event which presumably removes either Clinton or Trump from the race. In either of those cases, their party national committee would have to either reconvene the convention or make the choice themselves, based on what I have read. The VP pick for both parties is not guaranteed to be the replacement, so they will go with whoever they think will be the uniting factor. Bernie Sanders could replace Clinton, but after all the backstabbing from both sides before and during the convention I'm not sure the DNC would pick him. Chances are, it will be a safer bet like Joe Biden. For Trump, I would expect a Paul Ryan ticket but this isn't the same Republican Party that existed even 2 years ago, so I'm going to go with my gut here and say they'll pick Omarosa Manigault. I doubt you will find any common with either of those choices, so I advise you still stay home and just don't vote.

3. Care is such a strong word. 

Kind of like what Rumsfeld said:

There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.

There are also things we don't know we know. (DKK)

Rummy borrowed this stuff from legitimate group relations work. It's a shame it's associated with this war criminal.

as far as I'm concerned, there are few statements that are as boring and banal as saying that if more revelations about Hillary Clinton's emails are leaked, it could be damaging to her.

well sure.  And maybe there aren't any more revelations that will come out. Or maybe there will and they won't be damaging. Or maybe they will be. Or maybe a little damaging.  Or...

If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon...

GL2, The Iraq war was a disaster (possibly the worst geopolitical event in terms of its negative impact on the course of history since Europe sort of unthinkingly slipped into world war) but that does not make those responsible war criminals. That is an assertion too far and rankles every time I hear it. Nor does it make those who supported it at the time (I count myself as one) somehow bad.

that's a straw man.  The war crimes accusation is because many members of the Bush Administration from the president on down actually admitted ordering the torture of prisoners of war.

Whether they ever will or would be charged or could ever be convicted is a separate issue. But these people confessed to war crimes in public.

zoinks, this - for me - is akin to establishment GOPers going along with the Trump support. They know what they're doing; they know it's dangerous and wrong; and they're doing it anyway.

I don't use the term lightly.

Presently reading Bush by an esteemed presidential historian (Smith), and while he ultimately blames Bush, they all colluded.

ridski said:

BCC said:

'I don't think', 'It's impossible to tell', 'probably',

I was counting on you, but how am I to make up my mind when you can't make up yours.

You asked for further questions – how about this:

It has been agreed some unforeseen event could turn the the election on it's head overnight.

Even with your crystal ball, you can't see it, - because if you can see it, how can it be unforeseen?

Since that's the case how can you help me make up my mind if you can't tell me what that important
unforeseen event will be ?

Further, except for you and one or two others, no one seems to care why I choose to wait to see what happens.Why would they, and why do you?

1. So many things are unforeseen... Until they happen. Then in hindsight we analyse those events and the event chains which led up to them and ask ourselves "How did we not foresee this?" Sure, there will be someone out there who claims they foresaw it, and they'll say that no one listened. They'll point to their blogs and yell "See! The signs were there all along!" But we'll be dumbfounded how it could have happened, and we'll call for the resignations of those who should have noticed the red flags or forgot to report the tiniest details which could have prevented the event. There's not much which can be done in the end except to be stalwart and accept that we are humans and we make mistakes and miss things which should have been noticed. That is, of course, if these events are "Acts of God" or natural events. 

If there's an unforeseen event designed by another person, then it's not unforeseen at all, it's planned, and the extent to which a plan works or fails is based on how well the planners are able to cope with unforeseen events, too.

2. I cannot. And it's not my job to do so. I know that you have actually made some decisions already, so you're not really just waiting and seeing. I know you're not voting for Clinton or Trump. I doubt you'll vote for Gary Johnson as he believes that labor unions hurt the economy and wants to cut US aid to Israel, and has stated that he would not follow them into a war that they had started. And you won't vote for Jill Stein as she supports BDS, and has similar policies regarding Israel. Under those circumstances, I would advise staying at home. 

However, we're looking at an unforeseen event which presumably removes either Clinton or Trump from the race. In either of those cases, their party national committee would have to either reconvene the convention or make the choice themselves, based on what I have read. The VP pick for both parties is not guaranteed to be the replacement, so they will go with whoever they think will be the uniting factor. Bernie Sanders could replace Clinton, but after all the backstabbing from both sides before and during the convention I'm not sure the DNC would pick him. Chances are, it will be a safer bet like Joe Biden. For Trump, I would expect a Paul Ryan ticket but this isn't the same Republican Party that existed even 2 years ago, so I'm going to go with my gut here and say they'll pick Omarosa Manigault. I doubt you will find any common with either of those choices, so I advise you still stay home and just don't vote.

3. Care is such a strong word. 

Every thing you've written tells us what will happen after an unforeseen event occurs or is your
evaluation of how I will or will not vote.

We are not talking about what happens after it occurs and we are not talking about how I will or will not vote.

The question I asked was– why do you care how I do or do not vote– it seems no one else does,
and why should they?

I cannot believe anyone on MOL is concerned about this. Why are you?

BCC said:

ridski said:

BCC said:

'I don't think', 'It's impossible to tell', 'probably',

I was counting on you, but how am I to make up my mind when you can't make up yours.

You asked for further questions – how about this:

It has been agreed some unforeseen event could turn the the election on it's head overnight.

Even with your crystal ball, you can't see it, - because if you can see it, how can it be unforeseen?

Since that's the case how can you help me make up my mind if you can't tell me what that important
unforeseen event will be ?

Further, except for you and one or two others, no one seems to care why I choose to wait to see what happens.Why would they, and why do you?

1. So many things are unforeseen... Until they happen. Then in hindsight we analyse those events and the event chains which led up to them and ask ourselves "How did we not foresee this?" Sure, there will be someone out there who claims they foresaw it, and they'll say that no one listened. They'll point to their blogs and yell "See! The signs were there all along!" But we'll be dumbfounded how it could have happened, and we'll call for the resignations of those who should have noticed the red flags or forgot to report the tiniest details which could have prevented the event. There's not much which can be done in the end except to be stalwart and accept that we are humans and we make mistakes and miss things which should have been noticed. That is, of course, if these events are "Acts of God" or natural events. 

If there's an unforeseen event designed by another person, then it's not unforeseen at all, it's planned, and the extent to which a plan works or fails is based on how well the planners are able to cope with unforeseen events, too.

2. I cannot. And it's not my job to do so. I know that you have actually made some decisions already, so you're not really just waiting and seeing. I know you're not voting for Clinton or Trump. I doubt you'll vote for Gary Johnson as he believes that labor unions hurt the economy and wants to cut US aid to Israel, and has stated that he would not follow them into a war that they had started. And you won't vote for Jill Stein as she supports BDS, and has similar policies regarding Israel. Under those circumstances, I would advise staying at home. 

However, we're looking at an unforeseen event which presumably removes either Clinton or Trump from the race. In either of those cases, their party national committee would have to either reconvene the convention or make the choice themselves, based on what I have read. The VP pick for both parties is not guaranteed to be the replacement, so they will go with whoever they think will be the uniting factor. Bernie Sanders could replace Clinton, but after all the backstabbing from both sides before and during the convention I'm not sure the DNC would pick him. Chances are, it will be a safer bet like Joe Biden. For Trump, I would expect a Paul Ryan ticket but this isn't the same Republican Party that existed even 2 years ago, so I'm going to go with my gut here and say they'll pick Omarosa Manigault. I doubt you will find any common with either of those choices, so I advise you still stay home and just don't vote.

3. Care is such a strong word. 

Every thing you've written tells us what will happen after an unforeseen event occurs or is your
evaluation of how I will or will not vote.

We are not talking about what happens after it occurs and we are not talking about how I will or will not vote.

The question I asked was– why do you care how I do or do not vote– it seems no one else does,
and why should they?

I cannot believe anyone on MOL is concerned about this. Why are you?

See my answer numbered 3 above. 

The rest of the post concerns my answers to your questions. Am I to infer now that if you don't want me to answer a question you have posed, that question will come without a question mark, and that questions with question marks are rhetorical? It's hard to keep track.

ridski said:

BCC said:

ridski said:

BCC said:

'I don't think', 'It's impossible to tell', 'probably',

I was counting on you, but how am I to make up my mind when you can't make up yours.

You asked for further questions – how about this:

It has been agreed some unforeseen event could turn the the election on it's head overnight.

Even with your crystal ball, you can't see it, - because if you can see it, how can it be unforeseen?

Since that's the case how can you help me make up my mind if you can't tell me what that important
unforeseen event will be ?

Further, except for you and one or two others, no one seems to care why I choose to wait to see what happens.Why would they, and why do you?

1. So many things are unforeseen... Until they happen. Then in hindsight we analyse those events and the event chains which led up to them and ask ourselves "How did we not foresee this?" Sure, there will be someone out there who claims they foresaw it, and they'll say that no one listened. They'll point to their blogs and yell "See! The signs were there all along!" But we'll be dumbfounded how it could have happened, and we'll call for the resignations of those who should have noticed the red flags or forgot to report the tiniest details which could have prevented the event. There's not much which can be done in the end except to be stalwart and accept that we are humans and we make mistakes and miss things which should have been noticed. That is, of course, if these events are "Acts of God" or natural events. 

If there's an unforeseen event designed by another person, then it's not unforeseen at all, it's planned, and the extent to which a plan works or fails is based on how well the planners are able to cope with unforeseen events, too.

2. I cannot. And it's not my job to do so. I know that you have actually made some decisions already, so you're not really just waiting and seeing. I know you're not voting for Clinton or Trump. I doubt you'll vote for Gary Johnson as he believes that labor unions hurt the economy and wants to cut US aid to Israel, and has stated that he would not follow them into a war that they had started. And you won't vote for Jill Stein as she supports BDS, and has similar policies regarding Israel. Under those circumstances, I would advise staying at home. 

However, we're looking at an unforeseen event which presumably removes either Clinton or Trump from the race. In either of those cases, their party national committee would have to either reconvene the convention or make the choice themselves, based on what I have read. The VP pick for both parties is not guaranteed to be the replacement, so they will go with whoever they think will be the uniting factor. Bernie Sanders could replace Clinton, but after all the backstabbing from both sides before and during the convention I'm not sure the DNC would pick him. Chances are, it will be a safer bet like Joe Biden. For Trump, I would expect a Paul Ryan ticket but this isn't the same Republican Party that existed even 2 years ago, so I'm going to go with my gut here and say they'll pick Omarosa Manigault. I doubt you will find any common with either of those choices, so I advise you still stay home and just don't vote.

3. Care is such a strong word. 

Every thing you've written tells us what will happen after an unforeseen event occurs or is your
evaluation of how I will or will not vote.

We are not talking about what happens after it occurs and we are not talking about how I will or will not vote.

The question I asked was– why do you care how I do or do not vote– it seems no one else does,
and why should they?

I cannot believe anyone on MOL is concerned about this. Why are you?

See my answer numbered 3 above. 

The rest of the post concerns my answers to your questions. Am I to infer now that if you don't want me to answer a question you have posed, that question will come without a question mark, and that questions with question marks are rhetorical? It's hard to keep track.

Does this mean you are now prepared to answer the last 2 questions that had question marks?

They were not rhetorical.

not speaking for ridski, but --  while I don't care specifically how you are voting, I am concerned about anyone who professes to be a Democrat and a liberal and is taking a chance at helping Donald Trump be elected president by not voting for Hillary Clinton.

3. Care is such a strong word.

BCC said:

ridski said:

The question I asked was– why do you care how I do or do not vote– it seems no one else does,
and why should they?

I cannot believe anyone on MOL is concerned about this. Why are you?

See my answer numbered 3 above. 

Does this mean you are now prepared to answer the last 2 questions that had question marks?

They were not rhetorical.

ml1 said:

not speaking for ridski, but --  while I don't care specifically how you are voting, I am concerned about anyone who professes to be a Democrat and a liberal and is taking a chance at helping Donald Trump be elected president by not voting for Hillary Clinton.

Try googling 'why I won't vote for Hillary'. 

And not speaking for Riski - at this point I am still  waiting to see what transpires between now  

and November before coming to a decision, even if it is banal and I have already said it about 15 times.

ridski said:

3. Care is such a strong word.

BCC said:

ridski said:

The question I asked was– why do you care how I do or do not vote– it seems no one else does,
and why should they?

I cannot believe anyone on MOL is concerned about this. Why are you?

See my answer numbered 3 above. 

Does this mean you are now prepared to answer the last 2 questions that had question marks?

They were not rhetorical.

IOWs you won't answer.

I will leave it at that.

ml1 said:

not speaking for ridski, but --  while I don't care specifically how you are voting, I am concerned about anyone who professes to be a Democrat and a liberal and is taking a chance at helping Donald Trump be elected president by not voting for Hillary Clinton.

You should qualify that to say voters of New Jersey.  Hillary has the Garden State in her pocket.  If some individuals want to vote their conscience and write in for Bernie,  I will supply the pencil

between now and November Donald Trump is still going to be Donald Trump

author said:

You should qualify that to say voters of New Jersey.  Hillary has the Garden State in her pocket.  If some individuals want to vote their conscience and write in for Bernie,  I will supply the pencil

You know what that say about assuming..Make an as* of you and me.....

ml1 said:

that's a straw man.  The war crimes accusation is because many members of the Bush Administration from the president on down actually admitted ordering the torture of prisoners of war.

Whether they ever will or would be charged or could ever be convicted is a separate issue. But these people confessed to war crimes in public.

+1

ml1 said:

between now and November Donald Trump is still going to be Donald Trump

That's the beauty of the unforeseen event. You can't guarantee he will still be the candidate nor can you guarantee she will, nor can you or anyone else guarantee there will not be an unforeseen event that will affect the election in some other way.

In November that will all be 20-20 hindsight. Time to make a decision.

What's so hard to understand?

librarylady said:

author said:

You should qualify that to say voters of New Jersey.  Hillary has the Garden State in her pocket.  If some individuals want to vote their conscience and write in for Bernie,  I will supply the pencil

You know what that say about assuming..Make an as* of you and me.....

If earlier in my life I listened to what "they say",  I would be a retired attorney now..........living the good life.   I regret nothing,  To quote a more famous Jersey Boy " the record shows,  I took the blows,  and did it my way."

Never looked back

"Will you be going to work tomorrow?"

"I haven't decided yet. A lot can happen between now and tomorrow morning."

Clearly a ridiculous attitude. Obviously, if you wake up sick or some other unforeseen event happens, you won't go in to the office, but the the implicit assumption is knowing what you know now, what are your plans?

Someone struggling to decide if Clinton or Trump would be a better president isn't worried about some unforeseen event. Obviously we all retain the right to change our minds up through the moment we actually cast our vote. No, such a person amazingly sees both candidates as being roughly equal, given our current information. That blows my mind.

author said:

ml1 said:

not speaking for ridski, but --  while I don't care specifically how you are voting, I am concerned about anyone who professes to be a Democrat and a liberal and is taking a chance at helping Donald Trump be elected president by not voting for Hillary Clinton.

You should qualify that to say voters of New Jersey.  Hillary has the Garden State in her pocket.  If some individuals want to vote their conscience and write in for Bernie,  I will supply the pencil

Wow.  Talk about a taking a courageous stand.  But I assume, Author, that you were not always a slacktivist.

BCC said:

ml1 said:

between now and November Donald Trump is still going to be Donald Trump

That's the beauty of the unforeseen event. You can't guarantee he will still be the candidate nor can you guarantee she will, nor can you or anyone else guarantee there will not be an unforeseen event that will affect the election in some other way.

In November that will all be 20-20 hindsight. Time to make a decision.

What's so hard to understand?

Everyone understands that unforeseen events can take place. What befuddles people is why you are so insistent on repeating what may be the most obvious comment possible.

author said:

You should qualify that to say voters of New Jersey.  Hillary has the Garden State in her pocket.  If some individuals want to vote their conscience and write in for Bernie,  I will supply the pencil

That's not "voting their conscience".  That's voting their privilege.

They don't live in a battleground state, so they have the "privilege" to vote for a third party candidate with no fear on their part, that their state will wind up giving its electoral votes to Trump.  Then, they will exercise their "privilege" to say, "Well, I didn't vote for her", usually in discussion with people whose votes they are counting on, to make sure the state's electoral vote don't go to Trump.

Whatever works for you, I guess.

dave23 said:

BCC said:

ml1 said:

between now and November Donald Trump is still going to be Donald Trump

That's the beauty of the unforeseen event. You can't guarantee he will still be the candidate nor can you guarantee she will, nor can you or anyone else guarantee there will not be an unforeseen event that will affect the election in some other way.

In November that will all be 20-20 hindsight. Time to make a decision.

What's so hard to understand?

Everyone understands that unforeseen events can take place. What befuddles people is why you are so insistent on repeating what may be the most obvious comment possible.

https://www.liquidplanner.com/blog/how-to-adapt-to-change-and-uncertainty-in-your-project-plan/

ridski said:

dave23 said:

BCC said:

ml1 said:

between now and November Donald Trump is still going to be Donald Trump

That's the beauty of the unforeseen event. You can't guarantee he will still be the candidate nor can you guarantee she will, nor can you or anyone else guarantee there will not be an unforeseen event that will affect the election in some other way.

In November that will all be 20-20 hindsight. Time to make a decision.

What's so hard to understand?

Everyone understands that unforeseen events can take place. What befuddles people is why you are so insistent on repeating what may be the most obvious comment possible.

https://www.liquidplanner.com/blog/how-to-adapt-to-change-and-uncertainty-in-your-project-plan/

Does he plan liquid? Use liquid to make plans? Write plans in liquid? Me confused.

and you wonder why I call your observations banal.

BCC said:

nor can you or anyone else guarantee there will not be an unforeseen event that will affect the election in some other way.