Forming Group to Oppose "Keepers"

I should have edited to add the sarcasm emoticon perhaps. sorry all.

I choose to respond in a style with which you will probably find familiar. I will focus on only one narrow aspect of your post. Then I will say something silly that correlates my adventures with those of Greek Mythology.

To your quoted post I respond that my Cardiologist, my Urologist, and those who love me would differ with your reprensation that I am endowed with a little heart.

Should you choose to fight, I shall darken the sky with the massivity of my endowment.

author

And you can interpret this anyway your little heart desires...........

author said:

So any way they and a short time later VK joined the fray and brought fresh energy to us all..............

and fresh money and lawyers.

I should have just said "Fred and Dirk". And while I'm sure it's not entirely true, it was a proper, albeit sarcastic, point about a failure to speak up when the time was appropriate and when input was specifically being requested.

I commend all of the work everyone has done through the proper channels to better the project, especially Engage. It's unfortunate that their critical but constructive tactics seem to have now been poisoned by association with a new organization.

ctrzaska said:

ArchBroad should have said:
Apparently members of the Village Keepers didn't attend a TC, PB or MVA meeting in about four years.

Better now?

paulsurovell said:


I also support the idea of a write-in campaign for Jerry, and I'm planning to do that already.
As the public becomes more aware of the myths and scare tactics about the PO project that were used by the Lembrich campaign, I think a substantial write-in vote is possible. I don't think it's necessary to ask Jerry, in fact it might be better if he wasn't involved. Kind of like a draft.

has he said anything about this lawsuit yet? I'll admit I voted for him (I liked the "young families of Maplewood" angle), but unless he can convincingly distance himself from this mess, there is no way I would vote for him again. This whole thing is gross.

I'm not sure anyone actually needs to "oppose" VK. Currently, there are so many unanswered questions about them, it's probably sufficient to set up a table in town they way they did, and just hand out literature that repeats these questions:

https://maplewood.worldwebs.com/forums/discussion/id/117898-Fred-These-Are-Legitimate-Questions-Would-Appreciate-An-Answer#comment-3022962

plus a few more:

• did they inform all of their contributors that they are in part paying for a suit against the MVA?
• if they don't get favorable rulings agains the MVA and planning board, do they plan to bring suit against the township?
• what if anything is their alternative to the Post House

I think the initiative should be "Who Are The Village Keepers?"

If all the questions are answered, fine if people still support them. As I've been saying all along, whatever the outcome, if it's the consensus of the townspeople AND most importantly, based on fully transparent proceedings and accurate information, it's fine with me. But I'm not happy that an unaccountable and non-transparent group is influencing this process with hyperbolic information.

Perhaps I worded the thread title poorly. It's not about opposing Village Keepers per se. It's just about organizing a group on the other side of the issue to counter the pressure on the TC from VK, OhNo, Fred Profeta, et. al.

If there is a "movement" to obstruct the plans to demolish the existing building and replace it with a new mixed use building, those supporting the demolition and replacement need to be organized to get our point of view across.

ml1 said:
I'm not sure anyone actually needs to "oppose" VK. Currently, there are so many unanswered questions about them, it's probably sufficient to set up a table in town they way they did, and just hand out literature that repeats these questions:
https://maplewood.worldwebs.com/forums/discussion/id/117898-Fred-These-Are-Legitimate-Questions-Would-Appreciate-An-Answer#comment-3022962

plus a few more:

• did they inform all of their contributors that they are in part paying for a suit against the MVA?
• if they don't get favorable rulings agains the MVA and planning board, do they plan to bring suit against the township?
• what if anything is their alternative to the Post House

I'm not sure I care. Or as Hillary would say:

"What difference does it make?"

Unless we think that there is some other developer behind this who wants to buy the property at a lower price, and frankly I doubt it, I think it's a distraction.

Whether Village Keepers Inc. is solely Dirk Olin or he and a few others they are entitled to their opinion. I do not understand why they needed to incorporate but be that as it may I think the focus ought to be on showing the TC that there are many on the other side of the issue who think it important enough to organize and make their voices heard.

They incorporated to get around campaign financinig laws. They created signs and a map of where the signs went and then put Lembrich stickers on them.

Dave,

Not sure I understand. Would it have been illegal for Mr. Olin to do it as an individual in his own name? Or would it have been illegal for an unincorporated group like OhNo60 to do the same thing?

Basically if you form a political PAC you cannot endorse a candidate. They did. It's that simple.

Here is a new question:

If indeed Fred is memeber (or very least a vocal supporter, if not financial contributer) of Village Keepers and he is also a member of the MVA, then he participated in suing himself. Has he now resigned his position on the MVA board or recused himself from any further Post Office discussions within the MVA? Just a question. I have no idea of the legalities of any of this.

dave said:
Basically if you form a political PAC you cannot endorse a candidate. They did. It's that simple.

I still don't follow. I went to the ELEC website and put in the name Village Keepers Inc. to see what report, if any, they filed, and the result was that there was no information.

dave said:
They incorporated to get around campaign financinig laws. They created signs and a map of where the signs went and then put Lembrich stickers on them.

And pulled most of the signs down immediately after the election.

ml1 said:

• did they inform all of their contributors that they are in part paying for a suit against the MVA?

They're actually paying for both sides of the lawsuit. One side with their contributions to VKI, and the other side with their taxes.

CONFUSED said:

ml1 said:
I'm not sure anyone actually needs to "oppose" VK. Currently, there are so many unanswered questions about them, it's probably sufficient to set up a table in town they way they did, and just hand out literature that repeats these questions:
https://maplewood.worldwebs.com/forums/discussion/id/117898-Fred-These-Are-Legitimate-Questions-Would-Appreciate-An-Answer#comment-3022962

plus a few more:

• did they inform all of their contributors that they are in part paying for a suit against the MVA?
• if they don't get favorable rulings agains the MVA and planning board, do they plan to bring suit against the township?
• what if anything is their alternative to the Post House

I'm not sure I care. Or as Hillary would say:
"What difference does it make?"
Unless we think that there is some other developer behind this who wants to buy the property at a lower price, and frankly I doubt it, I think it's a distraction.

I agree that it's not as important as the other questions.

Well VK Inc. may be forced to answer those questions and others in the Discovery phase of the suit.

I just sent a private message "From Paul Surovell" to a few people who've posted on this thread. Please check "Messages" at the top of the screen.

paulsurovell said:
I just sent a private message "From Paul Surovell" to a few people who've posted on this thread. Please check "Messages" at the top of the screen.

Thanks

alias said:
I choose to respond in a style with which you will probably find familiar. I will focus on only one narrow aspect of your post. Then I will say something silly that correlates my adventures with those of Greek Mythology.
To your quoted post I respond that my Cardiologist, my Urologist, and those who love me would differ with your reprensation that I am endowed with a little heart.
Should you choose to fight, I shall darken the sky with the massivity of my endowment.

author

And you can interpret this anyway your little heart desires...........

Little heart is also used as a term of endearment.

But I do appreciate your allusions............especially since my Grandfather was a Spartan

dave said:
They incorporated to get around campaign financinig laws. They created signs and a map of where the signs went and then put Lembrich stickers on them.

The signs were placed on the lawns of home owners mostly by the home owners. The stickers were placed with the permission of the home owners also.

ml1 said:

author said:

So any way they and a short time later VK joined the fray and brought fresh energy to us all..............

and fresh money and lawyers.

And cookies..........lots of cookies.........you have to have cookies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP5Xv7QqXiM

Hold the phone ...

author said:

dave said:
They incorporated to get around campaign financinig laws. They created signs and a map of where the signs went and then put Lembrich stickers on them.

The signs were placed on the lawns of home owners mostly by the home owners. The stickers were placed with the permission of the home owners also.

... So, signs paid for by Village Keepers were turned into "Keep the Village a Village - Vote for Lembrich" signs?

I didn't see one of those, but that sure sounds like Village Keeper donations being used for the Lembrich campaign, if that is in fact what happened.

Don't forget...TC meeting tonight at 7:30 at the POLICE STATION, not Town Hall.

denniss said:
Don't forget...TC meeting tonight at 7:30 at the POLICE STATION, not Town Hall.

http://www.twp.maplewood.nj.us/AgendaCenter/ViewFile/Agenda/06162015-540?html=true

If anyone is interested, I think that one can appear at the start of the meeting for the "PUBLIC COMMENT - AGENDA ITEMS ONLY" portion of the meeting (since one item for discussion is: "5. Request from Maplewood Village Alliance for funding of legal representation for post office lawsuit.") to say:

"The Maplewood Village Alliance (MVA) has to respond to a lawsuit, because they followed Maplewood Township Ordinances. The post office project is the subject of a redevelopment plan, adopted by ordinance. The ordinance and the redevelopment plan included the usual language (which lawyers would recognize) that any other enactment which might be inconsistent doesn't invalidate what was adopted. The lawsuit contends that the MVA should have ignored the adoption of the redevelopment plan, and arrogated to itself the decision of whether or not to replace the existing post office building with new retail and residential construction. Since the MVA was doing its job, in evaluating the proposal under the redevelopment plan, I think it is only appropriate that the Township support the MVA in opposing the lawsuit. I think the MVA's funds are better spent towards maintaining and improving the Village for all of our residents, instead of fighting a baseless complaint."

Or, in the words of Mr. Arlo Guthrie -

"And if three people do it! Can you imagine three people walkin' in, ... They may think it's an
Organization!"

Just a suggestion. I am going to try to be there, but I may not make it.

Since I may not make it, I sent an email.

Quoted exactly as above. I encourage others to do likewise.

v.deluca@twp.maplewood.nj.us,
k.leventhal@twp.maplewood.nj.us,
mbrownlee@twp.maplewood.nj.us,
ILarrier@twp.maplewood.nj.us,
g.ryan@twp.maplewood.nj.us

Am planning on attending. Anyone know the parking situation at the police station

cmarym said:
Am planning on attending. Anyone know the parking situation at the police station

You can park in the Mormon church parking lot to go there (that's an official arrangement that the Township has for weekdays), or on the side streets.