FAFSA

Try to get exemption from FAFSA. If one is a refugee, military, foster and a few others, they are declared independent before age 24. I know it can be done.

conandrob240 said:

there is one parent. From a legal perspective, he essentially lives with a family friend. He does not live with the one legal parent. The person he lives with cannot file for him- she has no legal connection to him.

Allow me to rephrase: who is the custodial parent?

The sister-in-law (or perhaps, sister) to whom you've referred in the past; or the nephew's father?

TomR

TomR, I think I've been completely clear. There is only one parent. He resides with a family member who is not a parent.

As far as I'm reading, the exemptions are few and for: both parents deceased. Both parents incarcerated. Fled home due to abuse (with documented abuse trail). He does not qualify for any of the ones I read. "Parent is an as$&ole" is not a basis for exemption.

krugle said:

Try to get exemption from FAFSA. If one is a refugee, military, foster and a few others, they are declared independent before age 24. I know it can be done.

Can he prove that he doesn't live with parents? I'd give it a try.

conandrob240 said:

TomR, I think I've been completely clear. There is only one parent. He resides with a family member who is not a parent.

You have been oblique, in the extreme. (Most aptly demonstrated in the above quote).

You've written of your useless sister (or sister-in-law) for quite a while.

Who is the custodial parent? To which person did a Court of competent jurisdiction award custody of the minor nephew; if there ever was such a proceeding?

If you want guidance with financial aid, it would help if we understood the circumstances.

TomR

I couldn't be more clear, Tom. He has ONE legal parent. He does not live with that legal parent. He lives with a family friend. What part don't you understand? only the one legal parent can complete the FAFSA and that person refuses. From a financial aid perspective, that's all that matters.

Kruger, He may be able to be emancipated/declared independent on basis of not living with that legal parent, yes. But that would preclude him from suing the one legal parent for 1/2 tuition, right? and it may also mean legal parent could (would have to?) drop him from medical/dental insurance? Much to consider.

Here are the ways he can be independent:

1. Be 24 years of age or older by December 31 of the award year;
2. Be an orphan (both parents deceased), ward of the court, in foster care or was a ward of the court when 13 years or older;
3. Be a veteran of the Armed Forces of the United States or serving on active duty for other than training purposes;
4. Be a graduate or professional student;
5. Be a married individual;
6. Have legal dependents other than a spouse;
7. Be an emancipated minor or in legal guardianship;
8. Be a homeless youth;
9. Be a student for whom a financial aid administrator makes a documented determination of independence by reason of other unusual circumstances.

So, 7 is a possibility but comes with issues above. Not sure about 9? I guess if he picks a school, we can petition the financial aid administrator? This is where I read, though, that "special circumstances" are typically things like abuse, parents incarcerated. Extreme like that.

Sorry I'm meant to paste two different ones not sure what happened.

Tom_R said:

Eliz,

Thanks for the link. I'm familiar with the Newburg case and its progeny; but thanks for the reminder.

You posted the same link twice. Did you mean to post a second link, or have I overlooked something obvious.

Thanks again.

TomR

High School lets out in early summer? He can work 2 jobs through the summer and the fall and start school in January and live on campus, he should have more than enough to get through. If FA is going to be impossible encourage him to start on a workaround now. It will suck a ton, but how badly does he want out of there? What is he willing to do absent of student loans? It can be done.

I think he needs to become an emancipated minor. Get some legal advice. His father (only legal parent) does not support him with housing now and refuses to support him in the future. Can he not leave the household when he graduates high school and move in with you while he figures things out?

I think in an earlier thread I had suggested, and you didn't like, the military. Based on what you laid out above, a two year enlistment would get him out of the house and get him independence for the fafsa. Just a thought.

If it were me, I wouldn't want a loved one going into the military just now.

Such a small percentage of military personnel ever see combat that it wouldn't slow me down for a minute. You don't have to enlist in the army, try the navy or air force.

I think finaid.com suggested asking the school or college financial aid people talk with the unwilling parent. Maybe the same would apply to his high school staff? Any other third party? Would dad do that?? Does he need to be reassured that the info would not be revealed to your sister (is the divorce still in process?)?

FilmCarp, you're probably right about actual combat, but... 3 of my family members have been in the service over the past 10 years or so, and while none have been in combat, all have been in seriously dangerous locations (eg, Baghdad, Bagram...). And with the current administration, who knows what's next. It's a shame to feel so uneasy, because the military has been a valuable experience for so many over the years, but that's how it is.

No military. He's 100% against it and I wound not push him towards that with orange cheeto as his CIC.

sac said:

If it were me, I wouldn't want a loved one going into the military just now.

yes, I think the crux of it is that he does not want my sister to know his income because he has made up an amount of child support for the 2 kids they share biologically. Until recently, he has been generous so she didn't rock the boat with legal proceedings. But now, as of 2/15 (when he signed the house over to my parents, his co-owners) he has decided to be stingy. She is in the process of starting a legal process to secure the fair amount for the 2 kids. During which the first thing that will happen is that he'll be legally obligated to reveal his tax return. Based on what he has decided to pay her now (about 2/3 of the % NY mandates for 2 kids), he definitely is providing no financial support in any way to his teen son. He does pay his medical and dental insurance in full and has paid for some things like drivers ed but that's about it. He's 3 months away from 18 so not sure about emancipation now. I think that ship sailed.

But, you are right, perhaps reassurance of confidentiality from the kids school counselor might help. Good idea.

If he doesn't live with his legal parent, then I think it might be fair to say he has no custodial parent. I think custody means living with the caretaker. Maybe that means he could classify himself as an orphan, but that's just a wild guess.

I believe you or he should be able to file a motion with the family court requiring the father to provide a financial statement to the court and also to fill out the FAFSA. When he does this, the court might decide to recalculate child support. This could cause the support to go up or down, so there is some risk involved. If it goes up, your nephew might be able to tell the court that he will volunteer to accept less, and the court might or might not weigh that into its decision. In theory, you're not allowed to forego child support partially or fully, but in practice you can. On the other hand, it's the right time to ask for help with college tuition. If the father provides that instead of child support, that might be good enough.

You can file a motion with the court without a lawyer. The trick is to fill out the forms properly and send them in the prescribed manner. It's a bit tricky, but I did it a few times. The state has web pages with instructions, and the staff at the court will answer questions on the phone. The latter ended up not being very helpful to me, but it's worth a shot. This was a few years ago in Middlesex County.

divorcesource.com: College Tuition Payments in New Jersey

I think what you are trying to say is that he has one living biological parent. He does not live with his biological parent. The adult he lives with is not a biological or adoptive parent or legal guardian.

Tom is trying to help.

conandrob240 said:

I couldn't be more clear, Tom. He has ONE legal parent. He does not live with that legal parent. He lives with a family friend. What part don't you understand? only the one legal parent can complete the FAFSA and that person refuses. From a financial aid perspective, that's all that matters.

Kruger, He may be able to be emancipated/declared independent on basis of not living with that legal parent, yes. But that would preclude him from suing the one legal parent for 1/2 tuition, right? and it may also mean legal parent could (would have to?) drop him from medical/dental insurance? Much to consider.

If your sister has NOT adopted him, I am sorry but your nephew is out of luck. A parent refusing to fill out Fafsa does not qualify the student for any kind of exemption or independent status.

One more thing: Your ex-BIL's wife's income also has to be included on Fafsa. If the Fafsa parent is remarried, that spouse's income has to be included.

conandrob240 said:

yes, staying in his home for another year quite literally could be "the end of the world" for him. And the issue is this doesn't improve Year 2,3 or 4. If he won't do the FAFSA, this goes on for years (inability to secure even a loan)

if that is the case, he needs psychological help. Many kids go through hardship. He has it better than a lot of foster kids who are bounced around strange foster homes..not only has he had this friend to be there for him, he has you. even with financial aid, i don't think it would pay for his own apartment...he would still need a few roommates. He can look on craigslist for rooms for rent. If he would be comfortable, maybe he would like to live with an elderly gentleman who needs to rent out a room to make ends meet. The elderly can be easier to get along with than a same age peer as long as he is quiet and respectful and can live by house rules. By renting a room, he doesn't have to worry about roommates not paying up and getting evicted, he only has to worry about himself. A nice room with utilities (usually TV/internet also) is about 150/week in North/central NJ. There are some for 125...100 usually is a bad area.

Aldi is another job that pays better (as much as $14/hour depending on location), but they only hire full time which can make it hard to go to college. And they seem to mostly hire bilingual people.

Here's a question: What do you estimate is the combined income of your nephew's father and his wife?

The reason I ask is because your nephew may not have very much financial aid available to him anyway. The only possible aid for community college is this:

-Pell grant. The maximum Pell grant is around $5,000/year. But you have to be very low income to get this. IIRC your ex-BIL is a postman. Plus his wife has income? He would not be eligible for a Pell grant.
-Filling out Fafsa will also enable him to take out a subsidized Stafford loan. Maximum amount for first year of college is $5,500.
-Not sure if community colleges offer work study, but if they do, your nephew will be eligible for it. The maximum amount I believe is $3,000 per year. the advantage of taking a work-study job instead of a non-work-study job is that the income from a work-study job is not counted as income in the financial aid calculation for the following year.

Bottom line: The max he would most likely get is a loan for $5,500 and work-study.

yes, I was just reading that the new wife now also needs to be included. Ugh. I have absolutely no idea the new wife's income. She is 40 years old, has multiple disabilities and has always lived with her parents so my guess is she doesn't work or make very much if she does work. I have a solid sense of the teen's fathers' income because I did his taxes for years but only up until 2014. It's around $80k. He now has 6 dependents/6 in his family.

Shoshannah, this detail is helpful on what he could get without the properly filed FAFSA. It's good to know, he can at least get a small loan. That might cover 1-2 semesters of community college. Thank you.

conandrob240 said:

yes, I was just reading that the new wife now also needs to be included. Ugh. I have absolutely no idea the new wife's income. She is 40 years old, has multiple disabilities and has always lived with her parents so my guess is she doesn't work or make very much if she does work. I have a solid sense of the teen's fathers' income because I did his taxes for years but only up until 2014. It's around $80k. He now has 6 dependents/6 in his family.

If they file a joint return, the new wife's income will be included. Does she receive social security disability? I am not sure if that's included.

Also, I assume that your nephew receives some sort of support from your parents, you, and your sister? The house he lives in is considered support. That's considered income for your nephew. This is the question on Fafsa:

"Enter the total amount of cash support you [the student] (and if married, your spouse) received in 2015 from a friend or relative (other than your parents, if you are a dependent student). Report the amount if it is not reported elsewhere on this application.
If someone is paying rent, utility bills, etc., for you while you attend school, include the amount of that person's contributions, unless the person is your parentwhose information is reported on this application.
Include money that you received from a parent or other person whose financial information is not reported on this form and that is not part of a legal child support agreement.
Note: This includes distributions to you (the student beneficiary) from a 529 plan that is owned by someone other than you or your parents (such as your grandparents, aunts, uncles, and non-custodial parents)."

Bottom line: There is not very much financial aid to be had ANYWAY. See my post above. Unlikely he's going to get a Pell grant, or if he does it for certain will not be the full amount.

jmitw said:

conandrob240 said:

yes, staying in his home for another year quite literally could be "the end of the world" for him. And the issue is this doesn't improve Year 2,3 or 4. If he won't do the FAFSA, this goes on for years (inability to secure even a loan)

if that is the case, he needs psychological help. Many kids go through hardship. He has it better than a lot of foster kids who are bounced around strange foster homes..not only has he had this friend to be there for him, he has you. even with financial aid, i don't think it would pay for his own apartment...he would still need a few roommates. He can look on craigslist for rooms for rent. If he would be comfortable, maybe he would like to live with an elderly gentleman who needs to rent out a room to make ends meet. The elderly can be easier to get along with than a same age peer as long as he is quiet and respectful and can live by house rules. By renting a room, he doesn't have to worry about roommates not paying up and getting evicted, he only has to worry about himself. A nice room with utilities (usually TV/internet also) is about 150/week in North/central NJ. There are some for 125...100 usually is a bad area.

Aldi is another job that pays better (as much as $14/hour depending on location), but they only hire full time which can make it hard to go to college. And they seem to mostly hire bilingual people.

He can live with me or try a roommate. That would be fine. Recently, he's been saying he wants to move to CA to go to school and live with friends. Without FA, this wound be difficult for him.

Question about new wife being included. 2016 returns have not been filed. They were married in late October 2016. Since this year would use 2015, does she still need to be involved?

conandrob240 said:

Question about new wife being included. 2016 returns have not been filed. They were married in late October 2016. Since this year would use 2015, does she still need to be involved?

I would say you're in luck. Financial aid for the 2017-2018 academic year is based on the 2015 tax return. However, if your BIL wants to include his new wife and baby as members of his household, he will need to provide an "update letter," which will of course mean that the feds and school will want his new joint income.

Don't forget that your sister's and your mother's support for your nephew is considered untaxed income for your nephew.

Also, there is no possible way that F/A will be able to help him live on his own and go to community college.

shoshannah said:

I would say you're in luck. Financial aid for the 2017-2018 academic year is based on the 2015 tax return. However, if your BIL wants to include his new wife and baby as members of his household, he will need to provide an "update letter," which will of course mean that the feds and school will want his new joint income.

Don't forget that your sister's and your mother's support for your nephew is considered untaxed income for your nephew.

Also, there is no possible way that F/A will be able to help him live on his own and go to community college.

Not to hijack the thread but you seem very knowledgeable on this topic Shoshannah. Have you sent kids to college recently? I have one, due to go in about 2030. Is there something you know now you wish you did when they were 3? I put aside some for her now but with the rising costs, it seems impossible. Rutgers will cost 300K for full time, living in campus by then (before scholarships and grants). Any advice welcome.

Well, that's a plus at least for this year. If he takes a loan that can cover the cc tuition costs, leaving any income from work to only have to go to living expenses, then that FA helps, right? He can probably swing kuvibgbon his own if he works and has roommates but definitely can't pay that and tuition out of pocket.

shoshannah said:

conandrob240 said:

Question about new wife being included. 2016 returns have not been filed. They were married in late October 2016. Since this year would use 2015, does she still need to be involved?

I would say you're in luck. Financial aid for the 2017-2018 academic year is based on the 2015 tax return. However, if your BIL wants to include his new wife and baby as members of his household, he will need to provide an "update letter," which will of course mean that the feds and school will want his new joint income.

Don't forget that your sister's and your mother's support for your nephew is considered untaxed income for your nephew.

Also, there is no possible way that F/A will be able to help him live on his own and go to community college.