Demolishing Homes In Maplewood

joan_crystal said:

To get back on topic, I just read on Village Green that a stop work order has been issued for the subject property.  Mayor Dafis is cited as the source.  Reason given in the article is that the requested vertical survey and updated third floor plans were not received by the due date set by the town.  Source for that statement is given as the Director of Community Development.

Great news!

So let's go back in time to when there was no internet.  How would we have handled this?  The ball started rolling when one person in town, who happens to be an architect, posted pictures and asked about the project.  The response from Dean stemmed from that conversation. Facebook, despite all of its warts, helped in this situation.    In your happy olden days, would that person have called city hall?  How would the follow up be reported?  Solely in newspaper articles, if you paid for a subscription?  Would a stop work have been issued so quickly?  Would Galileo have been personally notified?  

A letter was sent out from Town Hall to all the neighbors. (In the past). In answer to Dan's previous question.

Only if there were variances sought, right?  There were no variances on this project

DanDietrich said:

So let's go back in time to when there was no internet. How would we have handled this? The ball started rolling when one person in town, who happens to be an architect, posted pictures and asked about the project. The response from Dean stemmed from that conversation. Facebook, despite all of its warts, helped in this situation. In your happy olden days, would that person have called city hall? How would the follow up be reported? Solely in newspaper articles, if you paid for a subscription? Would a stop work have been issued so quickly? Would Galileo have been personally notified?

I’ll have to recuse myself from any discussion that, in regards to the expectations of informed citizenship, likens signing up with Facebook and asking to join a private group to subscribing to a news source.

But I don’t think that discussion, or the information gaps that predated the internet, would shed much light anyway on the current communication practices of a local government that has a website (why is it Facebook or instead of Facebook and?) and email lists.

DanDietrich said:

Only if there were variances sought, right?  There were no variances on this project

Letter would have been sent out in response to neighbors concern regarding possible code violations.  It would be the most reliable means of notifying them.

Right, if the concern was reported.  But that is not a community wide response.  My point is that in this case Facebook helped.  That's where this began, not here or in a newspaper.  and really it was the pictures he posted that caused the response.  Another minor plus is that anyone who reads the responses from Dean will have a better understanding of how the permit application process works and why.  Unfortunately both MOL and FB share the common flaw that most folks don't read the thread before they post, so that tidbit gets lost.  

How is it possible that the plans were submitted and no one noticed that the vertical measurements were wrong? Shutting down the job site is an indication that someone dropped the ball on this project. No inspector ever drove by? I know they mostly wait until the framing is done to check, and maybe that’s why they missed it. See, I’m old school and  the inspector used to drive around in his little car from time to time. We shouldn’t have to wait for Facebook to keep on top of things. It’s ridiculous.

Did you read the explanation provided by Dean?  State law prohibits towns from asking for plans for one or two family homes for some reason.  They are expected to comply with zoning.  Really, his responses are thorough and worth reading.

I need to correct myself.  The state doesn't let towns  require site plans, but they do require building plans.  I was wrong about that.  While it is the site plan that would show the actual height on the lot, the actual plans should clearly have revealed that this thing is too big.

Elle_Cee said:

galileo said:

??? Results of vertical survey?

Did this inquiry start with you?  Bravo, if so.  I'm not understanding why if the questions were raised here initially, they weren't answered by our elected officials here as well.  I assume the platform the Mayor chose to issue his statement is SOMA Lounge.  

I just sent an email to each person on the Township Committee about this and about access in general to this forum.  SOMA Lounge is a private Facebook group where one has to apply to join and then be able to read and post. I found out from the current admins that the past admins blocked me twice from the Lounge in 2016 and then in 2017 and apparently that block still exists which is why the url didn't let me view the site. I have no idea why and did not receive any notice. The current admins who would not give me their names would not reconsider this. This message conversation was shared with the committee members by me. Frankly I don't care about the Lounge access in general but the TC cannot use that group as the sole way to communicate given that it is not a public Facebook page. Putting aside those who choose not join Facebook at all (like daveschmidt), this cannot be the sole way to communicate. Even when the hosts of this forum MOL have blocked folks consistently (think Strawberry as a poster not as a nice funny guy) he was still able to read things on the site. I won't be posting the committee members responses to me here but thought some of you might find this interesting.
Wendy Lauter

I would also like to add that it would make sense for Maplewood Twp to consider that, at a minimum, cross-posting here would draw support to MOL, a very local business, instead of just posting on (and supporting) Facebook.

sprout said:

I would also like to add that it would make sense for Maplewood Twp to consider that, at a minimum, cross-posting here would draw support to MOL, a very local business, instead of just posting on (and supporting) Facebook.

Great point sprout!

 The town is too reliant on using the Internet as their often sole means of communicating with residents.  We still have a significant portion of the town's residents who lack Internet access. We need a more inclusive way of sharing information.

joan_crystal said:

 The town is too reliant on using the Internet as their often sole means of communicating with residents.  We still have a significant portion of the town's residents who lack Internet access. We need a more inclusive way of sharing information.

That is not relevant to what is now being posted above. And actually I disagree with you but that is besides the point. Plenty of mail comes about information and all the libraries provide internet access.

It seems to me that the town has had no official response, which isn't good, but had an informal but thorough  response by one official on FB.  So really the solution that will come from this is that they will no longer post informally.  I know that our South Orange trustees are silent on FB, except for an occasional long answer from Sheena to correct misconceptions.  And those are much more rare now.   Newspapers, postcards, and their website will have to do.  

DanDietrich said:

It seems to me that the town has had no official response, which isn't good, but had an informal but thorough  response by one official on FB.  So really the solution that will come from this is that they will no longer post informally.  I know that our South Orange trustees are silent on FB, except for an occasional long answer from Sheena to correct misconceptions.  And those are much more rare now.   Newspapers, postcards, and their website will have to do.  

You are wrong. Any government official should be able to post on FB but if they do and it's the only venue they do so on and it's a private group then I will be pursuing their wrong doing as I am doing now. I am not talking about an official response. Read me clearly. Your ability to simplify things to post such incorrect items still amazes me.

Wendy Lauter

DanDietrich said:

It seems to me that the town has had no official response, which isn't good, but had an informal but thorough  response by one official on FB.  So really the solution that will come from this is that they will no longer post informally.  I know that our South Orange trustees are silent on FB, except for an occasional long answer from Sheena to correct misconceptions.  And those are much more rare now.   Newspapers, postcards, and their website will have to do.  

The information was also posted in a hyperlocal online news media which has been designated by the town as an official vehicle for the posting of public notices. Since I have a subscription to this media, I don't know if it was posted behind a paywall.

I'm not wrong.  They don't post.  Why should they?  Dean posted twice about this issue on FB and look at the response.  Some are mad that he didn't post here, some are mad that he did post there.   I simplify things sometimes to try to get to the root of the issue.  I don't know where you are coming from about that.   It's a fair argument that the town has not publicly responded to this issue.  It's also apparent from the FB discussion that the OP has gotten the runaround on his OPRA request.  But really the more that  people complain about unofficial communication channels the less they will use them.  I regret that, because I liked the explanations we used to get from Sheena.  

One should not post on a private Facebook page. I think the world of Sheena. Is that simple enough for you Dan? And the libraries should NOT be merged. lol!

Edited to apologize to Dan for my responses which are/were too harsh and caustic. We seem to want both towns to thrive and we have different opinions about the means. Below is a quote from DaveSchmidt on the recycling thread explaining why I and others have a problem with posting information solely on a private Facebook page that has the means of blocking access. I hope that clarifies more than I have done here. Again, I will try to be more civil.

From Daveschmidt:

They’re criticized not for additional means but for exclusive means.

More is better. More is officials copying informative and explanatory comments that they post to a private Facebook group and pasting them in a Hot Topics blog on the township website.

The town has its own public Facebook page.  Why not post on that?  Facebook refuseniks would not be able to participate in discussions, but at least we could read what's being said.  After doing a quick Internet search, I haven't found any municipalities that conduct public forums on their official websites.  I can only speculate on the reasons why that is, but it's unfortunate.  Democracy would benefit if discussions about public issues with government officials could be conducted on public websites.  

I believe the towns should be merged.  Maplewood would benefit from our lack of fraudulent contracts and fired whistleblowers.  We share fire, courts, IT, the health officer, and a school district.  I'm probably missing something.  It will happen eventually.  

I drove past the house in question today. A USA flag has been hung on the front door. I imagine this is some kind of statement about the situation. 

mrincredible said:

I drove past the house in question today. A USA flag has been hung on the front door. I imagine this is some kind of statement about the situation. 

yes that flag was put up the same day they got the stop order. Seems like a statement to me.

Is the flag taken down every evening or is there a light on it?

Oh Dave you silly man. It’s a prop, not an actual object of true reverence and patriotism. 

This same flag was flying earlier in this process for a few days and then taken down. Now it's up again. Not sure what this means.

dave said:

Is the flag taken down every evening or is there a light on it?

It’s being flown backwards. The field of stars is always to be displayed to the top left.

jimmurphy said:

It’s being flown backwards. The field of stars is always to be displayed to the top left.

A sign of protest.

Upside down is protest. Pretty sure this is just wrong.