BOE Election Results

I don't think the generational divide was among the candidates. It was among the voters. Anecdotally.

I think candidates were able to capture votes for all kinds of reasons, some potentially anecdotal. People vote for all types of reasons. People also remember bad experiences and don't usually appreciate nastiness.

I did not tout candidates here on MOL.

In real life, I had Maini Sabin signs on my lawn.

MOL is one barometer of public views, but not the only one.

mammabear said:
People also remember bad experiences and don't usually appreciate nastiness.

I would agree with you on this. The nastiness I experienced from the Latz campaign machine after a loss is something that I will never forget.

While I did not vote for Sabin and Maini, I am not at all worried about their competence or value to the board and community, nor about the direction our schools will take with them on the BOE.

Congratulations.

"I would agree with you on this. The nastiness I experienced from the Latz campaign machine after a loss is something that I will never forget."

I don't know who you are dg64, but perhaps the anonymous posts are one reason MOL gets so nasty. Even more than a name though it would be helpful to have a photo of someone, next to their ID. This would humanize a virtual connection. I learned this from teaching on-line courses. That face in the thumbnail is so important.

I have to say here that I myself will probably never forget the nastiness in anonymous posts spewed out by the Andrea Marino "machine," if you will, when I ran for the school board in 2012. It came at me like a bulldozer on this site and the erstwhile local Patch. It was pretty awful, though it certainly was a learning experience.

We live in a small community. I was reminded of this yet again when I met some lovely people yesterday campaigning for Maini and Sabin at the train station in South Orange, including people on the opposing tickets. Donna Smith, Joe and Elissa Malespina, Dharmvir Lind, are all gracious, kind, smart people. Though we no doubt differ in our views of education, we all shared a bond yesterday: complete exhaustion and exhilaration after a tough few weeks of political campaigning. All of us had a good laugh about the intensity of it all. In person, it is hard to forget that each and every person who spends his or her spare time working to get people elected to the school board has a deep, abiding commitment to do right by the children in our community. We do all want the same thing: to make sure that we are doing what we can to provide them with an excellent education that will prepare them for life. I really believe this. We may differ on the details of how to provide it, but we do share this goal, and I do think it is possible to find common ground toward this shared goal.

I occasionally check MOL for useful information about local news and recommendations for various things, and I sometimes post links to education-related news stories. But for a civil conversation, or productive exchange of ideas about the very complicated issue of public education, there really is no substitute for in-person, old-fashioned, face-to-face conversations. We should probably all do more of it. It is interesting that so many people have said that they only knew people supporting the same candidates as they themselves were supporting. The old echo chamber. This is revealing about divides in our community. I don't think MOL helps bridge those divides--in fact, I'm pretty sure it exacerbates them. The education summit coming up next week could be really productive, on many levels. I hope, at the very least, that it functions to create some goodwill and to build bridges across some of these divides, now that election season is over.

Elissa Malespina...gracious and kind? At the first debate hosted by the Hilton Neighborhood Association, she called Madhu Pai a "failure" and said, "Why would you want to vote for failure?" Didn't work out too well for her in the end, though.

I do plan to attend the education summit next week. I think it's been a long time since we had a superintendent who cared about our opinions.

So, it's possible to attack people in a public face to face forum too? Not just on MOL. Go figure...

yahooyahoo said:
I wouldn't call going from Daugherty to Eastman "turnover." Both have been on the BOE for many years including the Osborne years when the BOE was a rubber-stamp for his policies.

That was a turnover.

Debates don't really provide much of a forum for civil discussion either. That's not the alternative context I was suggesting. I'm not saying we live in Shangri la. I'm saying civility in any community takes place in contexts other than on line forums, and definitely not in political debates during our school board election campaigns. if we want to have productive discussions on education we should find those other contexts.

amyhiger said:
"I would agree with you on this. The nastiness I experienced from the Latz campaign machine after a loss is something that I will never forget."
I don't know who you are dg64, but perhaps the anonymous posts are one reason MOL gets so nasty.

I know who dg64 is because one of us reached out to the other through this forum (I can't recall who went first), and I think we'd do Rick and Louie proud. Thanks, MOL.

dg64 said:

mammabear said:
People also remember bad experiences and don't usually appreciate nastiness.

I would agree with you on this. The nastiness I experienced from the Latz campaign machine after a loss is something that I will never forget.

Not sure where this comes from, but it did not come from Steve Latz. I have worked on a few campaigns with Steve Latz and he was adamant about running a civil campaign, based on the issues, without nasty attacks. He's kind of a Bernnie Sandars type, now that I think of it--although I don't know if he would like that comparison.

nan said:

dg64 said:

mammabear said:
People also remember bad experiences and don't usually appreciate nastiness.

I would agree with you on this. The nastiness I experienced from the Latz campaign machine after a loss is something that I will never forget.

Not sure where this comes from, but it did not come from Steve Latz. I have worked on a few campaigns with Steve Latz and he was adamant about running a civil campaign, based on the issues, without nasty attacks. He's kind of a Bernnie Sandars type, now that I think of it--although I don't know if he would like that comparison.

I think he might.

There are plenty of people on the SOMA facebook pages who lack civility. It's not an MOL-only issue.

amyhiger said:
Debates don't really provide much of a forum for civil discussion either. That's not the alternative context I was suggesting. I'm not saying we live in Shangri la. I'm saying civility in any community takes place in contexts other than on line forums, and definitely not in political debates during our school board election campaigns. if we want to have productive discussions on education we should find those other contexts.

I don't think amyhiger really knows MOL at all and is certainly not qualified to paint it with the broad brush she's attempting to wield. MOL is by far the most civil and most informative online forum I've ever used. I get so much valuable information here and am impressed every day by the quality of the interchange between members. If you've been here long enough, you know how to evaluate what's being posted and whose contributions are worth listening to. You can't turn back the clock, Amy -- digital information exchange is here to stay, whether it's on MOL or Facebook or other social media or online platforms. Railing against it isn't going to do you any good with the constituencies you're going to need next time you decide to run for something...

JBennett said:
I don't know if there is a big generational divide here. Chris Sabin said in his Village Green interview that some people voted for him who remembered his mom. Peggy Freedson has an elementary school aged daughter who is only a few years older than Greg Lembrich's daughter. Peggy's daughter is younger than any of Chris Sabin and Annemarie Maini's children. Madhu's two children are both younger than Chris Sabin and Annemarie Maini's children too.

Candidates can win who have older children. Beth Daugherty's kids are graduated and she could win again if she ran. Wayne was the #1 vote getter in 2012. Sandra Karriem won in 2011 after her kids had graduated.

That is more complicated than the candidates positions on the issues.

Would you kindly make a chart?

After I was first elected the BOE in 1996 (!), I was talking with Leo Gordon, who had been returned to the board in the same election, about what 'message' the community intended through its choices. After a few minutes, David Asher, who was starting his ninth and final year on the board, let out an exasperated sigh and said, "You have no idea what just happened. The only thing you know is that you both got enough votes to win. That's it."

His point was a good one. This election, I know who I voted for, and I know why I voted for them. I can't really claim I know any more than that. Those elected have taken on a significant responsibility, and I wish all nine members of the board the best of luck with their roles.

As an aside, it's not that unusual for a sitting president of the Board to lose an election. It happened to me in 2005 and David Frazer the following year. There's no power base in being the board's president. If anything, you have to spend more of your time managing everyone else, including public perception. It may not surprise anyone reading this to hear that South Orange and Maplewood can be a pretty difficult community to please.

Is Steve Latz on a mission? What is up with him being behind all of these campaigns for so many years? How does he do it?????

I think that is the understatement of the decade.

brianoleary said:
After I was first elected the BOE in 1996 (!), I was talking with Leo Gordon, who had been returned to the board in the same election, about what 'message' the community intended through its choices. After a few minutes, David Asher, who was starting his ninth and final year on the board, let out an exasperated sigh and said, "You have no idea what just happened. The only thing you know is that you both got enough votes to win. That's it."
His point was a good one. This election, I know who I voted for, and I know why I voted for them. I can't really claim I know any more than that. Those elected have taken on a significant responsibility, and I wish all nine members of the board the best of luck with their roles.
As an aside, it's not that unusual for a sitting president of the Board to lose an election. It happened to me in 2005 and David Frazer the following year. There's no power base in being the board's president. If anything, you have to spend more of your time managing everyone else, including public perception. It may not surprise anyone reading this to hear that South Orange and Maplewood can be a pretty difficult community to please.

"Railing against it isn't going to do you any good with the constituencies you're going to need next time you decide to run for something..."

Not running for anything. I ran for something once in my life and that was a long time ago now. Why are you still talking about it? It's bizarre. I'm glad some people find this a valuable place to engage in discussions. I didn't mean any personal offense to you, but someone asked why MOL got the election results so wrong. I'm exiting the echo chamber now. Enjoy.

mod said:

chalmers said:

mod said:

Elle_Cee said:
What is the "Latz machine"?

Steve Latz has run BOE campaigns since for at least a decade- even longer perhaps

I believe of the current BOE and newly-elected BOE members, he has been involved in the campaigns of 6 of the 9 members of the Board- Maini, Sabin, Daughterty, Lawson-Muhammad, Baker and Jones.

And before them Bill Gaudelli, Andrea Wren Harden, David Giles and the unsuccessful campaigns of Higer,Swenson and Payne-Parish and a few more I've forgotten

FYI: Andrea Marino ran Andrea Wren-Hardin's first campaign.

I'd like to know more about Steve Latz too, especially now that it appears that his handpicked candidates hold a majority of seats on our Board of Ed. What's his deal and how did he become the "Kingmaker" for the School Board???

cel said:
I'd like to know more about Steve Latz too, especially now that it appears that his handpicked candidates hold a majority of seats on our Board of Ed. What's his deal and how did he become the "Kingmaker" for the School Board???

If Latz is a kingmaker in this district, it is because the rest of us don't get out and make a difference. As far as I can tell, BOE elections, unlike the T.C. elections in Maplewood, for example, are actually open and the candidates (Democrats only, in the case of the Maplewood T.C.) aren't hand-picked by some committee.

cel said:
I'd like to know more about Steve Latz too, especially now that it appears that his handpicked candidates hold a majority of seats on our Board of Ed. What's his deal and how did he become the "Kingmaker" for the School Board???

Interest. Work. Effort. Relationships within the community.

Off with his head!

So they're handpicked by Steve Latz instead, tjohn? What's the diff?

cel said:
So they're handpicked by Steve Latz instead, tjohn? What's the diff?

You are free to find a candidate you like and then work your a$$ off to get that candidate elected.

mjh said:

cel said:
So they're handpicked by Steve Latz instead, tjohn? What's the diff?

You are free to find a candidate you like and then work your a$$ off to get that candidate elected.

Amen. A cadre of volunteers fall behind the candidate of their choosing and bust butt for what and who they believe in -- win or lose. Kudos to all of the volunteers for all of the campaigns who gave their all. Alleged "king making" or any candidacy would be a hollow venture without the many volunteers who supported all nine candidates in this race.

Just watched a local news channel where they reported that one NJ district elected to the BOE a *deceased* incumbent running unopposed And a candidate with a criminal record who served prison time was just elected to the Paterson BOE. I'd say we are very lucky indeed.

cel said:
I'd like to know more about Steve Latz too, especially now that it appears that his handpicked candidates hold a majority of seats on our Board of Ed. What's his deal and how did he become the "Kingmaker" for the School Board???

Steve Latz was on the BOE a number of years ago (1990s?) and then was voted off or decided not to run again at some point. Around here, incumbency seems more often a disadvantage than an advantage in school board elections. Whether or not you agreed with him at the time, if you paid any attention, you know that he had (has) a huge body of knowledge of education theory and practice as well as statistics on all things education-related in New Jersey (and beyond.) He did his research! My impression is that he has now found his mission in supporting new candidates who embody his vision as the best way he can make a difference in the community. I can't really see any other personal benefit that he would accrue to him from his hard work in this regard.

Ego gratification?