Bill Browder and the Magnitsky Act. Humanitarian Act or Big Scam?
nan said:
nohero said:Not sure. From what I can tell, the information came from Anonymous and Wikileaks said some of it was false, and not sure who is responsible or the whole story. It happened very fast, so not many details yet. I will keep you updated.
nan said:So they got caught in a lie.
nohero said:Yes, Wikileaks took a look at it and said some of it was false, so it was removed for now. Do not know if the part that named Bill Browder was false.
nan said:Sorry! That evidence doesn't exist.
Anyway, the theory that Bill Browder gets away with his big whopper of a tale because he is a spy (hired part of a propaganda campaign) just got some new evidence:
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/1066480592689209344
According to Wikileaks, they have nothing published on Browder this year. At least, that's what searching on their site indicates (screenshot below). Whatever Max B and you thought was there, has been scrubbed.
I only hope my antivirus software is good enough, seeing as how I went onto their site ...
nohero said:
nan said:According to Wikileaks, they have nothing published on Browder this year. At least, that's what searching on their site indicates (screenshot below). Whatever Max B and you thought was there, has been scrubbed.
nohero said:Not sure. From what I can tell, the information came from Anonymous and Wikileaks said some of it was false, and not sure who is responsible or the whole story. It happened very fast, so not many details yet. I will keep you updated.
nan said:So they got caught in a lie.
nohero said:Yes, Wikileaks took a look at it and said some of it was false, so it was removed for now. Do not know if the part that named Bill Browder was false.
nan said:Sorry! That evidence doesn't exist.
Anyway, the theory that Bill Browder gets away with his big whopper of a tale because he is a spy (hired part of a propaganda campaign) just got some new evidence:
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/1066480592689209344
I only hope my antivirus software is good enough, seeing as how I went onto their site ...
Right, wikileaks did not publish it and they said some of it appeared to be false. Anonymous published it in their characteristic form: https://www.cyberguerrilla.org/blog/operation-integrity-initiative-british-informational-war-against-all/
As I said, I don't know what all of this means--but I will keep you posted. In the meantime, I found a new article by blogger Jimmy Llama, with details on the Browder murder accusations. I don't know what to think about these yet, but since Jamie was keen on this, I will post whatever I find--including the wacky stuff. According to this writer, Russia is accusing him of leading an international crime syndicate. The article is detailed and has charts so I'm still working my way through it.
Russia Files New Charges Against Browder, Accuses Him of Murder
https://jimmysllama.com/2018/11/20/11973/
The latest allegations coming out of Moscow, however, go well beyond any illegalities Browder or the Ziff brothers took part in with regards to unpaid taxes on illegal Gazprom shares. Russia is now accusing Browder of leading an international crime syndicate and ordering the murder of the very accountant he uses to boost his international prestige as a human rights activist and to dictate U.S. foreign policy.
Oh, and the blog above cites a Moscow Times article which has a more conventional reporting of the accusations made by Russian prosecutors. Seems we still need more details on this :
Russian Prosecutors Issue New Charges Against Kremlin Critic Browder
Russia has issued new charges against U.S.-born hedge fund manager William Browder, who has dismissed previous tax evasion convictions in the country as being politically motivated.
Russia branded Browder a national security threat and banned him from the country in 2005, when his Hermitage Capital fund held more than $4 billion in investments. In 2013 and 2017, Browder was convicted in absentia of tax evasion and sentenced to nine years in prison. Browder has been a vocal critic of the Kremlin administration and lobbied the passage of the Magnitsky Act in the United States in 2012 — which sanctions officials linked to human rights abuses — after the death of his lawyer Sergei Magnitsky in Russian pre-trial detention in 2009 in suspicious circumstances.
Browder could face 20 years in prison and asset seizures on charges of “creating a criminal organization,” Nikolai Atmonyev, an adviser to Russia’s general prosecutor, said in a televised briefing Monday.
“This organization was created in Russia in 1997 and continues to operate,” he told reporters.
Atmonyev said Russia would seek Browder’s arrest and extradition under the UN's Convention against Transnational Organized Crime, which allows countries without a bilateral agreement to extradite suspects.
Russian prosecutors also alleged that Browder may have been behind Magnitsky's poisoning, arguing that he “undoubtedly had a motive to remove him physically to cover up his role in previously committed crimes," though they did not include the allegation in the charges.
“I really struck a nerve with the Magnitsky Act,” Browder tweeted in response.
jamie said:
Moscow Times! Not biased at all.
Surprisingly not. What do you think sounded biased? Not much different from the version in the Financial Times, although they lie about Magnistsky being a whistleblower:
Moscow files criminal charges against financier Bill Browder
https://www.ft.com/content/141b7b52-ebe6-11e8-8180-9cf212677a57
Russian prosecutor Nikolai Atmonyev has said that it was also “highly likely” that Mr Browder had poisoned five people including Mr Magnitsky and Alexander Pereplichny, a whistleblower in the case who died mysteriously in England in 2012 amid suspicions of poisoning. But Moscow has provided no evidence for the poisoning claims nor filed any charges against Mr Browder in connection with them.
Meanwhile
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46338671
and a Russian ship ramming a Ukranian boat before taking it and two others (recorded and uploaded by Russians).
Is there a point where nan and Paul would draw a line on this behavior?
dave said:
Meanwhile
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46338671
and a Russian ship ramming a Ukranian boat before taking it and two others (recorded and uploaded by Russians).
Is there a point where nan and Paul would draw a line on this behavior?
I'm very concerned about what is going on in the Ukraine right now, thanks to US intervention:
FBI: Neo-Nazi Militia Trained by US Military in Ukraine Now Training US White Supremacists
More on the Offshore conference: here is the panel line-up for the The Sergei Magnitsky Case: Fact vs. Fiction- Lucy Komisar, Andrei Nekersov and Jamison Firestone https://www.offshorealert.com/conference/london/sergei-magnitsky-fact-vs-fiction/
Unfortunately, not the best videos:
Another absurd whatsboutism rebuttal from another very questionable source.
jamie said:
Another absurd whatsboutism rebuttal from another very questionable source.
Here is valid whataboutism - I need to remind you again--the mainstream media goes along with the lie that is Bill Browder's story. There is no excuse for that.
Except, of course, that the mainstream media probably knows more about this than someone who sits on the couch all day getting her "news" from Jimmy Dore
nan said:
More on the Offshore conference: here is the panel line-up for the The Sergei Magnitsky Case: Fact vs. Fiction- Lucy Komisar, Andrei Nekersov and Jamison Firestone https://www.offshorealert.com/conference/london/sergei-magnitsky-fact-vs-fiction/
Does Lucy Komisar's appearance on the panel mean that her fundraising scheme you posted about here last month has paid off?
nan said:
Excellent interview on Fault lines radio with Lucy Komisar with an update on all things Bill Browder, including what is going on in Cyrus and an upcoming conference in Norway where the Andrei Nekrasov film will be screened followed by a panel discussion. She goes into detail about how reporter Ken Dilanian wrote an article for NBC on the Browder fraud, but they would not run it. She is trying to raise money to self-publish. This is from her webpage:
https://www.thekomisarscoop.com/2018/10/radio-interview-mass-western-censorship-the-lockdown-of-truth-surrounding-browder-and-magnitsky/
On Fault Lines with Garland Nixon and Lee Stranahan, I talked about how NBC-TV killed its reporter Ken Dilanian’s exposé of William Browder.That happened in May 2016, a month before the Trump Tower meeting that fueled Russiagate and jump-started the Mueller investigation. US media refuses to publish my investigation of what happened, so I have started a GoFundMe page and will post and make the story available when I reach $5,000.I also talked about an academic meeting I will speak at in Stavenger, Norway, Oct 17 to 20. Subjects, “How to do investigative journalism when corporations control the media” and “The Browder/Magnitsky hoax” — how William Browder started his companies on Mossack Fonseca British Virgin Islands shells, built his wealth by cheating on Russian taxes and invented the Magnitsky fable to get US help in blocking Russian law enforcement from collecting $70 million in his illicit gains.Here is the video:
jamie said:
where is Jamison’s video?
I posted it. You can watch him lie about Magnitsky being tortured, despite easily verifiable facts.
https://twitter.com/LucyKomisar/status/106354895465319628
Here is the link to the medical report on Magnitsky's death: http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/WSJ-20091229-MagnitskyReport.pd
The medical report says Magnitsky died of untreated illness. Browder, in his book, Red Notice, says Magnitsky called him on a cell phone and he heard him screaming while being beaten. Browder actually says Mangitsky, while being beaten to death in prison, was able to make a phone call and alert Browder to his torture. Really, and this is considered non-fiction.
South_Mountaineer said:
nan said:Does Lucy Komisar's appearance on the panel mean that her fundraising scheme you posted about here last month has paid off?
More on the Offshore conference: here is the panel line-up for the The Sergei Magnitsky Case: Fact vs. Fiction- Lucy Komisar, Andrei Nekersov and Jamison Firestone https://www.offshorealert.com/conference/london/sergei-magnitsky-fact-vs-fiction/
nan said:
Excellent interview on Fault lines radio with Lucy Komisar with an update on all things Bill Browder, including what is going on in Cyrus and an upcoming conference in Norway where the Andrei Nekrasov film will be screened followed by a panel discussion. She goes into detail about how reporter Ken Dilanian wrote an article for NBC on the Browder fraud, but they would not run it. She is trying to raise money to self-publish. This is from her webpage:
https://www.thekomisarscoop.com/2018/10/radio-interview-mass-western-censorship-the-lockdown-of-truth-surrounding-browder-and-magnitsky/
On Fault Lines with Garland Nixon and Lee Stranahan, I talked about how NBC-TV killed its reporter Ken Dilanian’s exposé of William Browder.That happened in May 2016, a month before the Trump Tower meeting that fueled Russiagate and jump-started the Mueller investigation. US media refuses to publish my investigation of what happened, so I have started a GoFundMe page and will post and make the story available when I reach $5,000.I also talked about an academic meeting I will speak at in Stavenger, Norway, Oct 17 to 20. Subjects, “How to do investigative journalism when corporations control the media” and “The Browder/Magnitsky hoax” — how William Browder started his companies on Mossack Fonseca British Virgin Islands shells, built his wealth by cheating on Russian taxes and invented the Magnitsky fable to get US help in blocking Russian law enforcement from collecting $70 million in his illicit gains.Here is the video:
That fund raising, a normal thing independent journalists do, was for one specific story, as clearly stated.
dave said:
And Jimmy has no sense of humor...
Is there even one Jimmy Dore video in this thread? Since you seem to enjoy the pile on with Sbenois that I get all my news from Jimmy Dore, please show me all the Jimmy Dore videos on Bill Browder and/or Lucy Komisar. Cause I'm sure you would not want to join in on such an extreme statement without evidence, right?
sbenois said:
Even Jimmy Dore is laughing at her.
nan said:
dave said:Is there even one Jimmy Dore video in this thread? Since you seem to enjoy the pile on with Sbenois that I get all my news from Jimmy Dore, please show me all the Jimmy Dore videos on Bill Browder and/or Lucy Komisar. Cause I'm sure you would not want to join in on such an extreme statement without evidence, right?
And Jimmy has no sense of humor...
And that's the point. Not even Jimmy Dore rants about this.
nan said:
South_Mountaineer said:That fund raising, a normal thing independent journalists do, was for one specific story, as clearly stated.
Does Lucy Komisar's appearance on the panel mean that her fundraising scheme you posted about here last month has paid off?
nan said:
Excellent interview on Fault lines radio with Lucy Komisar with an update on all things Bill Browder, including what is going on in Cyrus and an upcoming conference in Norway where the Andrei Nekrasov film will be screened followed by a panel discussion. She goes into detail about how reporter Ken Dilanian wrote an article for NBC on the Browder fraud, but they would not run it. She is trying to raise money to self-publish. This is from her webpage:
https://www.thekomisarscoop.com/2018/10/radio-interview-mass-western-censorship-the-lockdown-of-truth-surrounding-browder-and-magnitsky/
On Fault Lines with Garland Nixon and Lee Stranahan, I talked about how NBC-TV killed its reporter Ken Dilanian’s exposé of William Browder.That happened in May 2016, a month before the Trump Tower meeting that fueled Russiagate and jump-started the Mueller investigation. US media refuses to publish my investigation of what happened, so I have started a GoFundMe page and will post and make the story available when I reach $5,000.
Independent journalists seek funding in order to continue their work, such as to go to an area where they will report from, or to do the research for a story they're working on. "I have started a GoFundMe page and will post and make the story available when I reach $5000" isn't that. She has a story, but instead of just putting it on her platform or giving the details on RT, she "teases" it in order to monetize it.
Seems like Andrei's video got cut off. Overall, I thought he and Lucy were very ineffective with their arguments. I did catch Jamison - he had some good questions for Andrei and Lucy which couldn't be answered.
Might be hard to read all of this on here - but all relevant questions are posted on the screen behind Lucy - maybe she'll come out with the answers to them on her site.
South_Mountaineer said:
sbenois said:
Even Jimmy Dore is laughing at her.
nan said:And that's the point. Not even Jimmy Dore rants about this.
dave said:Is there even one Jimmy Dore video in this thread? Since you seem to enjoy the pile on with Sbenois that I get all my news from Jimmy Dore, please show me all the Jimmy Dore videos on Bill Browder and/or Lucy Komisar. Cause I'm sure you would not want to join in on such an extreme statement without evidence, right?
And Jimmy has no sense of humor...
Not a fair comparison, as people commenting on Bill Browder are rare, although those that look closely usually get that his story is fake.
jamie said:
Seems like Andrei's video got cut off. Overall, I thought he and Lucy were very ineffective with their arguments. I did catch Jamison - he had some good questions for Andrei and Lucy which couldn't be answered.
What were Jaimison's questions? Andrei spoke about this presentation in the last Fault Lines video I posted and he said Jaimison could not answer questions and dodged anything difficult and Lucy called him out for false information on the death (see my posting above).
I would like to hear the answers to those questions (and where they came from). I will let you know if either of them posts those.
Jamison's questions were on the big video screen behind Lucy that I posted.
Biggest question to me is: Why do you ignore who got the money and that the Russian Government isn't looking for it?
jamie said:
Jamison's questions were on the big video screen behind Lucy that I posted.
Biggest question to me is: Why do you ignore who got the money and that the Russian Government isn't looking for it?
How do you know those are Jaimison's questions?
nan said:
jamie said:How do you know those are Jaimison's questions?
Jamison's questions were on the big video screen behind Lucy that I posted.
Biggest question to me is: Why do you ignore who got the money and that the Russian Government isn't looking for it?
Did you watch what you posted? Or only the speaker's you want to watch? It was the last slide of his presentation. 
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Not sure. From what I can tell, the information came from Anonymous and Wikileaks said some of it was false, and not sure who is responsible or the whole story. It happened very fast, so not many details yet. I will keep you updated.