All you need to know about the Dakota Access Oil Pipeline (DAPL) protests
A glimmer of hope as dozens of journalists and thousands of veterans descend on Standing Rock (my emphasis on "probably"):
North Dakota Governor Jack Dalrymple said on Wednesday it was "probably not feasible" to reroute the pipeline, but he would try to rebuild a relationship with Standing Rock Sioux leaders.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-north-dakota-pipeline-idUSKBN13R0WM
President Obama said in early November that:
the Army Corps is examining whether there are ways to reroute this pipeline
0dollars2cents said:
We are at the part of the debate where you've conceded losing on facts, so you're poking holes in my (semi-joking) use of insult terms.
Hippies...not hippies...who cares. Poorly educated and misguided people-- that work?
Point is USA needs more modern pipelines, and DAPL is a step in the right direction.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
anti-DAPL is the left wing version of fake news. Construction company did everything by the book, was granted all the necessary permits, did community meetings, completed legally mandated environmental studies etc etc etc. Look it up, if you don't believe me.
"environmental genocide" and all that is pretty lame and unfounded in facts. Real tragedy = events like Lac-Mégantic which can be avoided w modern pipelines.
Kick out the hippies and finish the pipeline! (since when did being a veteran mean you couldn't be a silly hippie??)
;Hippies are by definition silly...........I should know. At the same time, many of my "hippy" friends served time
at Allenwood and other government facilities at one time. I doubt that these Service People are hippies........
the two terms are contradictory. Although crisis can make for some strange bedfellows
Better get your Bi Focals adjusted Grandpa
dollars, Since you are so pro-pipeline I suggest you put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house in Chatham so you can have the Pilgrim Pipeline in your very own backyard. They are trying to build a pipeline that will carry South Dakota Bakken crude from Albany to a Linden refinery and back. The Pilgrim Pipeline will be built in residential areas of Chatham, New Providence, Berkeley Heights, FLorham Park and right next to the reservoir in Livingston. Every single NY and NJ municipality through which the proposed pipeline will be built has passed resolutions against it. In the last few years surveyors for the pipeline regularly trespassed on the property of private homeowners and when challenged told them they had court orders allowing them there, which was a blatant lie. So, if you are so adamant that people should allow pipelines on their land, put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house real cheap just a few miles away that will have one in it's own back yard.
What Sarah says is a chilling thought. Certainly not a well publicized one and I certainly hope there is opposition
building somewhere
I'm happy where I'm at, thanks for the offer.
I assume you wrote this email from the warm comfort of your natural-gas heated home. Am I wrong? Guess how that gas arrived from the ground--> your house. Last I checked, New Jersey isn't a hotbed of oil & gas production.
There's nothing progressive about being an obstructionist to updating this country's crumbling energy infrastructure. That oil & gas IS getting transported. The choice is (A) pipes built in 1950's (B) trains and trucks (C) modern pipes (D) we give up our comfortable nat-gas heated homes and live in the stone ages again. Pick a side.
sarahzm said:
0dollars2cents said:
We are at the part of the debate where you've conceded losing on facts, so you're poking holes in my (semi-joking) use of insult terms.
Hippies...not hippies...who cares. Poorly educated and misguided people-- that work?
Point is USA needs more modern pipelines, and DAPL is a step in the right direction.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
anti-DAPL is the left wing version of fake news. Construction company did everything by the book, was granted all the necessary permits, did community meetings, completed legally mandated environmental studies etc etc etc. Look it up, if you don't believe me.
"environmental genocide" and all that is pretty lame and unfounded in facts. Real tragedy = events like Lac-Mégantic which can be avoided w modern pipelines.
Kick out the hippies and finish the pipeline! (since when did being a veteran mean you couldn't be a silly hippie??)
;Hippies are by definition silly...........I should know. At the same time, many of my "hippy" friends served time
at Allenwood and other government facilities at one time. I doubt that these Service People are hippies........
the two terms are contradictory. Although crisis can make for some strange bedfellows
Better get your Bi Focals adjusted Grandpa
dollars, Since you are so pro-pipeline I suggest you put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house in Chatham so you can have the Pilgrim Pipeline in your very own backyard. They are trying to build a pipeline that will carry South Dakota Bakken crude from Albany to a Linden refinery and back. The Pilgrim Pipeline will be built in residential areas of Chatham, New Providence, Berkeley Heights, FLorham Park and right next to the reservoir in Livingston. Every single NY and NJ municipality through which the proposed pipeline will be built has passed resolutions against it. In the last few years surveyors for the pipeline regularly trespassed on the property of private homeowners and when challenged told them they had court orders allowing them there, which was a blatant lie. So, if you are so adamant that people should allow pipelines on their land, put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house real cheap just a few miles away that will have one in it's own back yard.
I'm far less familiar w Pilgrim than DAPL so can't speak to Pilgrim in detail. Certainly I don't support trespassing or breaking the law to build something. I've yet to see evidence DAPL relied on illegal methods to get permits approved in 5 separate states (that would be quite the conspiracy).
I assume you wrote this email from the warm comfort of your natural-gas heated home. Am I wrong? Guess how that gas arrived from the ground to your house. Last I checked, New Jersey isn't a hotbed of oil & gas production.
There's nothing progressive about being an obstructionist to updating this country's crumbling (and leaking) energy infrastructure. Bakken oil & gas IS getting transported. Choices are (A) pipes built in 1950's (B) trains and trucks (C) modern pipes (D) we give up our comfortable nat-gas heated homes and live in the stone ages again. Pick a side.
sarahzm said:
0dollars2cents said:
We are at the part of the debate where you've conceded losing on facts, so you're poking holes in my (semi-joking) use of insult terms.
Hippies...not hippies...who cares. Poorly educated and misguided people-- that work?
Point is USA needs more modern pipelines, and DAPL is a step in the right direction.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
anti-DAPL is the left wing version of fake news. Construction company did everything by the book, was granted all the necessary permits, did community meetings, completed legally mandated environmental studies etc etc etc. Look it up, if you don't believe me.
"environmental genocide" and all that is pretty lame and unfounded in facts. Real tragedy = events like Lac-Mégantic which can be avoided w modern pipelines.
Kick out the hippies and finish the pipeline! (since when did being a veteran mean you couldn't be a silly hippie??)
;Hippies are by definition silly...........I should know. At the same time, many of my "hippy" friends served time
at Allenwood and other government facilities at one time. I doubt that these Service People are hippies........
the two terms are contradictory. Although crisis can make for some strange bedfellows
Better get your Bi Focals adjusted Grandpa
dollars, Since you are so pro-pipeline I suggest you put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house in Chatham so you can have the Pilgrim Pipeline in your very own backyard. They are trying to build a pipeline that will carry South Dakota Bakken crude from Albany to a Linden refinery and back. The Pilgrim Pipeline will be built in residential areas of Chatham, New Providence, Berkeley Heights, FLorham Park and right next to the reservoir in Livingston. Every single NY and NJ municipality through which the proposed pipeline will be built has passed resolutions against it. In the last few years surveyors for the pipeline regularly trespassed on the property of private homeowners and when challenged told them they had court orders allowing them there, which was a blatant lie. So, if you are so adamant that people should allow pipelines on their land, put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house real cheap just a few miles away that will have one in it's own back yard.
Yes, it is.
I don't know why or when "pipeline" became a scary word. Building modern pipelines lowers risk of spills and likely saves lives (see: Lac-Mégantic). Usually being pro-environment and pro- saving lives gets you labelled as a hippy romantic. Funny how w pipelines, it's the opposite.
DAPL is >1,000 miles over 5 states. You can imagine the incredible amount of permitting required for such a project. The construction company spent several years working with local and federal authorities as well as local communities to build DAPL by the book (look it up). All it took was some fake news headlines to mobilize the extreme wing of the "progressives" to make the drama we have today.
Morganna said:
Is it too hippy too romantic?
0dollars2cents said:
Yes, it is.
I don't know why or when "pipeline" became a scary word. Building modern pipelines lowers risk of spills and likely saves lives (see: Lac-Mégantic). Usually being pro-environment and pro- saving lives gets you labelled as a hippy romantic. Funny how w pipelines, it's the opposite.
DAPL is >1,000 miles over 5 states. You can imagine the incredible amount of permitting required for such a project. The construction company spent several years working with local and federal authorities as well as local communities to build DAPL by the book (look it up). All it took was some fake news headlines to mobilize the extreme wing of the "progressives" to make the drama we have today.
Morganna said:
Is it too hippy too romantic?
And then the pipeline breaks...........maybe not immediately but as it ages. And of what value then are the
permits and the promises?
They should not be on treaty land.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/11/08/standing-rock-and-imperialism-itself/
0dollars2cents said:
Yes, it is.
I don't know why or when "pipeline" became a scary word. Building modern pipelines lowers risk of spills and likely saves lives (see: Lac-Mégantic). Usually being pro-environment and pro- saving lives gets you labelled as a hippy romantic. Funny how w pipelines, it's the opposite.
DAPL is >1,000 miles over 5 states. You can imagine the incredible amount of permitting required for such a project. The construction company spent several years working with local and federal authorities as well as local communities to build DAPL by the book (look it up). All it took was some fake news headlines to mobilize the extreme wing of the "progressives" to make the drama we have today.
Here's the summary of an analysis of Dakota Access Pipeline's (DAPL) environmental assessment (EA) by Accufacts, Inc., a firm that assesses pipeline safety risks, among other things. The analysis found the EA to be seriously deficient:
http://earthjustice.org/sites/default/files/files/10-28-16-Final-Accufacts-Report.pdf
Re: Accufacts Review of the US Army Corps of Engineers (USACE) Environmental Assessment (EA) for the Dakota Access Pipeline (“DAPL”)
I. Summary
Accufacts Inc. (“Accufacts”) was asked to perform a detailed pipeline technical review of the above EA for the DAPL proposal, including the USACE’s mitigated finding of no significant impact.1 I have concluded that the EA is seriously deficient and cannot support the finding of no significant impact, even with the proposed mitigations. The analysis is incomplete such that potential risks and impacts to the federal areas and waters have not been adequately presented nor evaluated. Important details are missing in the EA. As explained below, the EA understates the risks of pipeline failure and related oil release from this pipeline impacting Lake Oahe and the Missouri River. Additional information, not provided in the EA, is needed to prudently assess this pipeline proposal, as well as to evaluate various key assumptions and claims that the USACE relies upon in their incomplete mitigation approaches and finding.
This EA specifically focused on two federal flowage easements: one near the upper end of Lake Sakakawea, in Williams County, North Dakota, and the other in federally-owned property at Lake Oahe in Morton and Emmons Counties, North Dakota.2 The USACE states that “The EA addresses the purpose and need of the pipeline, as well as the location and method of installation of the pipeline, but the analysis is limited to the effects of allowing the pipeline to cross federal flowage easements near the upper end of Lake Sakakawea, and federally owned lands at Lake Oahe in North Dakota.”3
In analyzing the pipeline technical issues in the EA, Accufacts has determined there are at least four major areas of deficiency in the EA as they relate to potential DAPL future oil spill risks that could impact the above sensitive areas:
1. The EA fails to properly evaluate the impact of the DAPL, including the risk of oil spills, on the federal easements and waters of the United States.
2. The ability to timely remotely identify oil releases are overstated and unsubstantiated.
3. The lack of specific information in the EA strongly suggests deficiencies in the worst case discharge determination that could affect the unusually sensitive areas, and related oil spill response planning.
4. Nondestructive testing for girth weld inspection should clearly specify 100% radiographic testing.
Accufacts provides neutral technical evaluation on pipeline matters, based on over 40 years experience in the field and pipeline incident investigation (see Attachment 2, Kuprewicz CV).
Accufacts’ major findings and conclusions are discussed in further detail below:
Details for these conclusions appear here:
http://earthjustice.org/sites/default/files/files/10-28-16-Final-Accufacts-Report.pdf
"every pipeline could eventually break" is a childish argument. Every car trip to the grocery store could be the day ur life ends in a fiery crash. I don't see too many people walking to Stop & Shop.
Best we could do is apply modern technology by building new pipelines, thereby lowering reliance on outdated pipelines and trains/trucks, and significantly lowering risk of future spills.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
Yes, it is.
I don't know why or when "pipeline" became a scary word. Building modern pipelines lowers risk of spills and likely saves lives (see: Lac-Mégantic). Usually being pro-environment and pro- saving lives gets you labelled as a hippy romantic. Funny how w pipelines, it's the opposite.
DAPL is >1,000 miles over 5 states. You can imagine the incredible amount of permitting required for such a project. The construction company spent several years working with local and federal authorities as well as local communities to build DAPL by the book (look it up). All it took was some fake news headlines to mobilize the extreme wing of the "progressives" to make the drama we have today.
Morganna said:
Is it too hippy too romantic?
And then the pipeline breaks...........maybe not immediately but as it ages. And of what value then are the
permits and the promises?
If you think building essential infrastructure through a small part of reservation land equates to imperialism, then you don't know what imperialism is.
nan said:
They should not be on treaty land.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/11/08/standing-rock-and-imperialism-itself/
Are you equating a pipeline that will carry approximately 100,000 gallons of crude oil per hour to the pipelines that were installed when this neighborhood was developed in order to supply homes with natural gas. Really ???? Do you think we are naïve enough to fall for that false equivalency ????
Who actually owns the land? I have not been able to figure that out. I do think that the right of American citizens to be guaranteed clean water to drink outweighs the rights of big business and big money to make a greater profit. Don't fool yourself ( or try to fool anyone else). That is the only thing this is really about. If the pipeline was safer but more expensive than current transport methods it wouldn't be built.
I think guarantees made by our government ( on behalf of very American Citizen) in the form of treaties with the Dakota Sioux should outweigh the permits ( that may or may not have been properly granted ) given to big business. I'm not against big business. But I believe that our government was conceived to be of the people and for the people and that one of the most important, even sacred responsibilities of government is to protect the interests of the weak from greed of the more powerful.
0dollars2cents said:
I'm far less familiar w Pilgrim than DAPL so can't speak to Pilgrim in detail. Certainly I don't support trespassing or breaking the law to build something. I've yet to see evidence DAPL relied on illegal methods to get permits approved in 5 separate states (that would be quite the conspiracy).
I assume you wrote this email from the warm comfort of your natural-gas heated home. Am I wrong? Guess how that gas arrived from the ground to your house. Last I checked, New Jersey isn't a hotbed of oil & gas production.
There's nothing progressive about being an obstructionist to updating this country's crumbling (and leaking) energy infrastructure. Bakken oil & gas IS getting transported. Choices are (A) pipes built in 1950's (B) trains and trucks (C) modern pipes (D) we give up our comfortable nat-gas heated homes and live in the stone ages again. Pick a side.
sarahzm said:
0dollars2cents said:
We are at the part of the debate where you've conceded losing on facts, so you're poking holes in my (semi-joking) use of insult terms.
Hippies...not hippies...who cares. Poorly educated and misguided people-- that work?
Point is USA needs more modern pipelines, and DAPL is a step in the right direction.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
anti-DAPL is the left wing version of fake news. Construction company did everything by the book, was granted all the necessary permits, did community meetings, completed legally mandated environmental studies etc etc etc. Look it up, if you don't believe me.
"environmental genocide" and all that is pretty lame and unfounded in facts. Real tragedy = events like Lac-Mégantic which can be avoided w modern pipelines.
Kick out the hippies and finish the pipeline! (since when did being a veteran mean you couldn't be a silly hippie??)
;Hippies are by definition silly...........I should know. At the same time, many of my "hippy" friends served time
at Allenwood and other government facilities at one time. I doubt that these Service People are hippies........
the two terms are contradictory. Although crisis can make for some strange bedfellows
Better get your Bi Focals adjusted Grandpa
dollars, Since you are so pro-pipeline I suggest you put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house in Chatham so you can have the Pilgrim Pipeline in your very own backyard. They are trying to build a pipeline that will carry South Dakota Bakken crude from Albany to a Linden refinery and back. The Pilgrim Pipeline will be built in residential areas of Chatham, New Providence, Berkeley Heights, FLorham Park and right next to the reservoir in Livingston. Every single NY and NJ municipality through which the proposed pipeline will be built has passed resolutions against it. In the last few years surveyors for the pipeline regularly trespassed on the property of private homeowners and when challenged told them they had court orders allowing them there, which was a blatant lie. So, if you are so adamant that people should allow pipelines on their land, put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house real cheap just a few miles away that will have one in it's own back yard.
I am well versed on difference btw transportation pipelines and distribution pipelines. Larger point here: energy infrastructure is essential to keep our homes warm. Either we let it rot and leak, or we update it. Distribution pipes rely on transportation pipes like DAPL--natural gas didn't appear here in NJ by magic.
Please be careful throwing around scary statements like "guaranteed clean water" bc you are walking a thin line between a reasoned argument and fear mongering. Some very smart people in Army Corps of Engineers cleared DAPL. Good place to start for info here: http://www.nwo.usace.army.mil/Media/Fact-Sheets/Fact-Sheet-Article-View/Article/749823/frequently-asked-questions-dapl/
There aren't pro-guaranteed clean water and anti-guaranteed clean water sides to this debate. Everyone wants clean water. The debate is about addressing a ticking time bomb (see my first post, roughly 50% of US transportation pipelines are ~ 40-50+ yrs old; crude by rail is dangerous).
sarahzm said:
Are you equating a pipeline that will carry approximately 100,000 gallons of crude oil per hour to the pipelines that were installed when this neighborhood was developed in order to supply homes with natural gas. Really ???? Do you think we are naïve enough to fall for that false equivalency ????
Who actually owns the land? I have not been able to figure that out. I do think that the right of American citizens to be guaranteed clean water to drink outweighs the rights of big business and big money to make a greater profit. Don't fool yourself ( or try to fool anyone else). That is the only thing this is really about. If the pipeline was safer but more expensive than current transport methods it wouldn't be built.
I think guarantees made by our government ( on behalf of very American Citizen) in the form of treaties with the Dakota Sioux should outweigh the permits ( that may or may not have been properly granted ) given to big business. I'm not against big business. But I believe that our government was conceived to be of the people and for the people and that one of the most important, even sacred responsibilities of government is to protect the interests of the weak from greed of the more powerful.
0dollars2cents said:
I'm far less familiar w Pilgrim than DAPL so can't speak to Pilgrim in detail. Certainly I don't support trespassing or breaking the law to build something. I've yet to see evidence DAPL relied on illegal methods to get permits approved in 5 separate states (that would be quite the conspiracy).
I assume you wrote this email from the warm comfort of your natural-gas heated home. Am I wrong? Guess how that gas arrived from the ground to your house. Last I checked, New Jersey isn't a hotbed of oil & gas production.
There's nothing progressive about being an obstructionist to updating this country's crumbling (and leaking) energy infrastructure. Bakken oil & gas IS getting transported. Choices are (A) pipes built in 1950's (B) trains and trucks (C) modern pipes (D) we give up our comfortable nat-gas heated homes and live in the stone ages again. Pick a side.
sarahzm said:
0dollars2cents said:
We are at the part of the debate where you've conceded losing on facts, so you're poking holes in my (semi-joking) use of insult terms.
Hippies...not hippies...who cares. Poorly educated and misguided people-- that work?
Point is USA needs more modern pipelines, and DAPL is a step in the right direction.
author said:
0dollars2cents said:
anti-DAPL is the left wing version of fake news. Construction company did everything by the book, was granted all the necessary permits, did community meetings, completed legally mandated environmental studies etc etc etc. Look it up, if you don't believe me.
"environmental genocide" and all that is pretty lame and unfounded in facts. Real tragedy = events like Lac-Mégantic which can be avoided w modern pipelines.
Kick out the hippies and finish the pipeline! (since when did being a veteran mean you couldn't be a silly hippie??)
;Hippies are by definition silly...........I should know. At the same time, many of my "hippy" friends served time
at Allenwood and other government facilities at one time. I doubt that these Service People are hippies........
the two terms are contradictory. Although crisis can make for some strange bedfellows
Better get your Bi Focals adjusted Grandpa
dollars, Since you are so pro-pipeline I suggest you put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house in Chatham so you can have the Pilgrim Pipeline in your very own backyard. They are trying to build a pipeline that will carry South Dakota Bakken crude from Albany to a Linden refinery and back. The Pilgrim Pipeline will be built in residential areas of Chatham, New Providence, Berkeley Heights, FLorham Park and right next to the reservoir in Livingston. Every single NY and NJ municipality through which the proposed pipeline will be built has passed resolutions against it. In the last few years surveyors for the pipeline regularly trespassed on the property of private homeowners and when challenged told them they had court orders allowing them there, which was a blatant lie. So, if you are so adamant that people should allow pipelines on their land, put your money where your mouth is. I can sell you a house real cheap just a few miles away that will have one in it's own back yard.
0dollars2cents said:
If you think building essential infrastructure through a small part of reservation land equates to imperialism, then you don't know what imperialism is.
nan said:
They should not be on treaty land.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/11/08/standing-rock-and-imperialism-itself/
They are extending the country's power and influence onto tribal lands through military force. That's imperialism. What makes you think this is "essential infrastructure?" The oil might just be for export to the highest bidder.
Though Promised for Domestic Use, Dakota Access Pipeline May Fuel Oil Exports
https://theintercept.com/2016/09/01/dakota-access-export/
Has anyone seen this link? The reporter is on location and from SOMA.
https://www.facebook.com/jacksmithiv
He recommends a website to donate directly but when I found it there was a warning about the site.
Here is a page from the campsite.
Friend just returned from the camp. They are setting up for the long haul. Winterizing, setting up medic and counseling centers, a school for the kids, a communications center. Very impressed and hopeful that this incredible undertaking will make a difference.
NizhoniGrrrl said:
Friend just returned from the camp. They are setting up for the long haul. Winterizing, setting up medic and counseling centers, a school for the kids, a communications center. Very impressed and hopeful that this incredible undertaking will make a difference.
I think those in power are forgetting something. The Native Americans.............those who live in and nearby the
area are descendants of those who bit off Custer's soul. They are not to be taken lightly
Veterans coming to Standing Rock have brought the media with them. Even Stars and Stripes is on the scene:
http://www.stripes.com/veterans-arrive-at-standing-rock-to-help-protesters-brace-for-winter-1.442512
0dollars2cents said:
I am well versed on difference btw transportation pipelines and distribution pipelines. Larger point here: energy infrastructure is essential to keep our homes warm. Either we let it rot and leak, or we update it. Distribution pipes rely on transportation pipes like DAPL--natural gas didn't appear here in NJ by magic.
Please be careful throwing around scary statements like "guaranteed clean water" bc you are walking a thin line between a reasoned argument and fear mongering. Some very smart people in Army Corps of Engineers cleared DAPL. Good place to start for info here: http://www.nwo.usace.army.mil/Media/Fact-Sheets/Fact-Sheet-Article-View/Article/749823/frequently-asked-questions-dapl/
There aren't pro-guaranteed clean water and anti-guaranteed clean water sides to this debate. Everyone wants clean water. The debate is about addressing a ticking time bomb (see my first post, roughly 50% of US transportation pipelines are ~ 40-50+ yrs old; crude by rail is dangerous).
A few points:
(1) The Army Corps of Engineers' "Fact Sheet" does not address the analysis cited above by Accufacts which found the Corps' Environmental Assessment (EA) to be "seriously deficient."
(2) The Army Corps' EA was also challenged by senior officials of three Federal agencies: the Environmental Protection Agency, the Department of Interior and the Advisory Council on Historic Preservation:
https://insideclimatenews.org/news/30082016/dakota-access-pipeline-standing-rock-sioux-army-corps-engineers-approval-environment
Senior officials at the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and two
other federal agencies raised serious environmental and safety
objections to the North Dakota section of the controversial Dakota
Access oil pipeline, the same objections being voiced in a large protest
by the Standing Rock Sioux tribe that has so far succeeded in halting
construction. But those concerns were dismissed by the U.S. Army Corps
of Engineers, which relied on an environmental assessment prepared by the
pipeline's developer, Dakota Access LLC, when it approved the project in July,
according to public documents.
(3) Finally, the operator of DAPL will be Sunoco Logistics, which has the worst record of pipeline spills among all US pipeline operators. Sunoco pipelines have had more than 200 leaks since 2010.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-pipeline-nativeamericans-safety-i-idUSKCN11T1UW
Paul............you can always be counted on for a valid early morning submission. If I am not sleeping at that
hour I am usually searching for an episode of " Law and Order" which I have not seen"
I am so happy now that the Veterans and the Press have arrived at Standing Rock
Truly the Marines have landed
"Accufacts" is one dude who did zero primary research. Like those doctors who went on TV during the election and concluded Hillary is really sick despite never speaking w the patient or seeing her medical records.
also Accufacts is a consulting firm w clear bias.
I'll roll w the Army Corps of Engineers who who did the actual research, working under a Democratic potus no less. If u think there's a government conspiracy to build a leaky pipeline that spans 5 states, i duno what to tell u. Well, i do actually: you're an obstructionist. Party of No, basically. Good luck w crude by rail--i hear those never leak!
lol, the article u link to explains:
- most spills contained at terminals or lightly used out of date pipelines
- incidence of large spills down sharply since 2012
blindly hating on pipeline operators like Sunoco is the worst of "progressives". you profoundly don't know what you're talking about. Did u even read this article past the headline? (serious question)
paulsurovell said:
(3) Finally, the operator of DAPL will be Sunoco Logistics, which has the worst record of pipeline spills among all US pipeline operators. Sunoco pipelines have had more than 200 leaks since 2010.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-pipeline-nativeamericans-safety-i-idUSKCN11T1UW
Progressive fake news alert! Juuuuust enough truth to make for a scary headline, while ignoring the actual facts and legal framework that governs how these projects are done.... u know.... in the real world.
1,261-page environmental study was reviewed and independently verified by the Army Corps of Engineers. But hey, we should ignore that and call them liars, and rely on "Accufacts" 10-page troll job instead.
. But those concerns were dismissed by the U.S. Army Corps
of Engineers, which relied on an environmental assessment prepared by the
pipeline's developer, Dakota Access LLC, when it approved the project in July,
according to public documents.
Wasn't it the Army Corp or Engineers that recently wanted to build a large Dam into South Mountain Reservation
I believe they also said it would have no Environmental Impact
Didn't go over to well either with residents of Essex County
I believe eventually the Army Corp backed out of the project
0dollars2cents said:
"Accufacts" is one dude who did zero primary research. Like those doctors who went on TV during the election and concluded Hillary is really sick despite never speaking w the patient or seeing her medical records.
also Accufacts is a consulting firm w clear bias.
I'll roll w the Army Corps of Engineers who who did the actual research, working under a Democratic potus no less. If u think there's a government conspiracy to build a leaky pipeline that spans 5 states, i duno what to tell u. Well, i do actually: you're an obstructionist. Party of No, basically. Good luck w crude by rail--i hear those never leak!
That's not a rebuttal of the Accufacts report. That's a dodge.
0dollars2cents said:
Progressive fake news alert! Juuuuust enough truth to make for a scary headline, while ignoring the actual facts and legal framework that governs how these projects are done.... u know.... in the real world.
1,261-page environmental study was reviewed and independently verified by the Army Corps of Engineers. But hey, we should ignore that and call them liars, and rely on "Accufacts" 10-page troll job instead.
. But those concerns were dismissed by the U.S. Army Corps
of Engineers, which relied on an environmental assessment prepared by the
pipeline's developer, Dakota Access LLC, when it approved the project in July,
according to public documents.
I don't think anyone has questioned whether the Army Corps approved the plan. The question is whether the Corps addressed the concerns raised by the three Federal agencies. And I don't see where it did.
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There is a great one in Jerusalem where many devout people spend their time talking and other forms of communicating . Try it , you'll like it