"Restorative circles" WTF.

Money is part of the problem. Studies show that money spent keeping kids in school and out of the criminal justice system is more cost effective than money spent on juvenile or adult criminal justice. However, there is no easy way politically to reallocate funding.

Suspensions are not purely, or even mainly, done out of a wish to punish an offender. They're there to protect the student body. As a student I saw them dealt out most commonly for fighting, which put an automatic time out of a week or so between the 2 parties.

In the case of criminal sexual contact, the suspension has more of a value in giving the victim the ability to go back to school not in fear. Don't any of you remember the dread you had as a middle schooler when there was an "issue"? Imagine how it would feel if the issue was criminal, and was violent and dehumanizing?

Imagine the dread and fear, and then the utter embarassment, despair, and loneliness in realizing people said they cared, but did nothing, and shuffled you off to a counselor, and that people in your town spent most of their time worrying about the future of the assaulters and not you.

I wonder if they may come to school anymore themselves. I wonder what the girl who was assaulted 4 times and was largely ignored until her dad made it an embarrassing issue on a message board felt. I wonder if she asked herself, what more can I do, other than just accept that these young men can lay claim to my body however and whenever they want, in a place where I am compelled to be? What can I do to stop this? Who can help me?

And then I wonder about the kid who would get suspended, wondering, what can I do to end this bad situation? Oh I got it! I'll just stop assaulting girls. Boom, done.

He has a way out, and it's entirely under his control. She doesn't.

susan1014 said:

sprout said:Again, find me the study that shows this, because the recent studies I've been exposed to critique this premise as false. Findings indicate that as suspensions cause a loss of instructional time, the resulting inability to succeed in their coursework increases the probability of recidivism for many students.

It is likely because of this finding that alternatives for suspension are currently in-vogue.

I would agree that out of school suspensions are often a dreadful answer, because they reward kids who don't like being at school with time out of school, and shift the burden to parents to somehow make time at home into an effective punishment (which is tough for parents who work outside the home, for example).
However, there are many other in-school options that either do exist or could exist. Restorative justice is only one of them, and only appropriate to some situations. Other options include:
- In school suspension (do we have this?)
- Placement in an alternative school setting in-district (not currently an option in SOMSD)
- Creation of an IEP focused on behavioral issues (is this is a pattern of behavior, rather than a one-time problem), followed by placement in a school focusing on behaviorally challenged youth of the appropriate age
I don't know enough about the current situation to know if the offenders have been dealt with appropriately...I recognize that the administration may be constrained in what it can tell us.

Agreed.

I also agree with jackson_fusion that a girl (or boy) who is assaulted deserves to be able to go to school without dread and fear, and that that may require moving one or the other child to a different setting. It seems fairer to move the offender than the victim, unless the victim wants to be moved.

Suspension may be a necessary short-term response, but it is not a long-term solution in all cases.

susan1014 said:
I also agree with jackson_fusion that a girl (or boy) who is assaulted deserves to be able to go to school without dread and fear, and that that may require moving one or the other child to a different setting. It seems fairer to move the offender than the victim, unless the victim wants to be moved.
Suspension may be a necessary short-term response, but it is not a long-term solution in all cases.

Again, agreed.

From my limited exposure to RJ literature, I've seen versions where the victim has the power to determine if the offender's proposal to make amends is accepted, or if it the victim deems it insufficient for the offender to return to the 'school society'.

To me, some versions read like legal mediation, while other versions read like group therapy.

spontaneous said:
It wasn't harassment, it was assault. The school is attempting to downplay it by calling it harassment

Does anyone know the actual legal difference between sexual harassment and sexual assault in the state of New Jersey ? Just curious. Also, what legal consequences are attached to both in the case of a minor

annielou said:

spontaneous said:
It wasn't harassment, it was assault. The school is attempting to downplay it by calling it harassment

Does anyone know the actual legal difference between sexual harassment and sexual assault in the state of New Jersey ? Just curious. Also, what legal consequences are attached to both in the case of a minor

I had to look it up on my phone (Internet isn't working on the desk top) and it is apparently called "sexual criminal contact" under 2c. I don't know the legal definition of harassment, but I do know that once they purposely touched the victims breasts and/or buttocks it became assault

spontaneous said:

annielou said:

spontaneous said:
It wasn't harassment, it was assault. The school is attempting to downplay it by calling it harassment

Does anyone know the actual legal difference between sexual harassment and sexual assault in the state of New Jersey ? Just curious. Also, what legal consequences are attached to both in the case of a minor

I had to look it up on my phone (Internet isn't working on the desk top) and it is apparently called "sexual criminal contact" under 2c. I don't know the legal definition of harassment, but I do know that once they purposely touched the victims breasts and/or buttocks it became assault

It covers a lot, and most is as mentioned earlier reportable under Megan's Law both for adults and minors.

sprout said:

susan1014 said:
I also agree with jackson_fusion that a girl (or boy) who is assaulted deserves to be able to go to school without dread and fear, and that that may require moving one or the other child to a different setting. It seems fairer to move the offender than the victim, unless the victim wants to be moved.
Suspension may be a necessary short-term response, but it is not a long-term solution in all cases.

Again, agreed.
From my limited exposure to RJ literature, I've seen versions where the victim has the power to determine if the offender's proposal to make amends is accepted, or if it the victim deems it insufficient for the offender to return to the 'school society'.
To me, some versions read like legal mediation, while other versions read like group therapy.

I can't imagine the mindset that would make adjudication by a 12-14 year old victim of a peer's offense make sense. Either intimidated into going easy or inclined to go for some real adolescent rough justice, how in the world can anyone expect a fair outcome?

Unless, of course, the outcome you're looking for is to duck responsibility for making a decision and instead dump it on a bunch of victim children and their parents- then it makes total sense

Everyone seems to be focused on the school, but I still haven't seen an answer as to what came of the call to the police.

If a crime was committed, why were no charges filed?

ParticleMan said:
Everyone seems to be focused on the school, but I still haven't seen an answer as to what came of the call to the police.
If a crime was committed, why were no charges filed?

I believe the girl's father just wanted the problem to stop and didn't really feel a need to press charges or at least that is what I remember of the discussion at the time. It wasn't that he was afraid or that his daughter was afraid - they just wanted to end the unwanted contact. Now, what the school is required to do independent of victim preferences, I do not know.

In this case, it seems like a reasonable approach. Now, having said that, assuming that rules and expectations are clarified, I wouldn't expect leniency this year.

The MMS offender could have been be transferred to SOMS. That would have interrupted the stalking dynamic, too, if was the case that the same student was involved in more than one of the three incidents involving the same girl.

Jackson_Fusion said:
Suspensions are not purely, or even mainly, done out of a wish to punish an offender. They're there to protect the student body. As a student I saw them dealt out most commonly for fighting, which put an automatic time out of a week or so between the 2 parties.
In the case of criminal sexual contact, the suspension has more of a value in giving the victim the ability to go back to school not in fear. Don't any of you remember the dread you had as a middle schooler when there was an "issue"? Imagine how it would feel if the issue was criminal, and was violent and dehumanizing?
Imagine the dread and fear, and then the utter embarassment, despair, and loneliness in realizing people said they cared, but did nothing, and shuffled you off to a counselor, and that people in your town spent most of their time worrying about the future of the assaulters and not you.
I wonder if they may come to school anymore themselves. I wonder what the girl who was assaulted 4 times and was largely ignored until her dad made it an embarrassing issue on a message board felt. I wonder if she asked herself, what more can I do, other than just accept that these young men can lay claim to my body however and whenever they want, in a place where I am compelled to be? What can I do to stop this? Who can help me?


And then I wonder about the kid who would get suspended, wondering, what can I do to end this bad situation? Oh I got it! I'll just stop assaulting girls. Boom, done.
He has a way out, and it's entirely under his control. She doesn't.

This is an outstanding post. I fully agree. Protecting the victims needs to be the absolute priority.

And a large part of that protection has to be focused on their emotions and security. If that is not the focus of these "restorative circles" then the schools response may be wildly misguided.

ParticleMan said:
Everyone seems to be focused on the school, but I still haven't seen an answer as to what came of the call to the police.
If a crime was committed, why were no charges filed?

If there were charges we wouldn't hear about it. We're talking about children between the ages of 11-14. Such matters would not be made public.