The Fight for Kherson
I love it when the Russian army takes a town but can’t defend it. They are goat bludgeoning defenseless people in towns and cities, but run like pu$$ies when the Ukrainian army starts bombing them like sitting ducks.
Lol- it’s the western government pushing for this offensive- I cannot watch one more Duran video!
jamie said:
Lol- it’s the western government pushing for this offensive- I cannot watch one more Duran video!
I have stopped laughing at this stupid stuff she posts, she’s just effing crazy.
jamie said:
Lol- it’s the western government pushing for this offensive- I cannot watch one more Duran video!
They need the optics of Ukraine winning something so they can justify spending more money on this loser of a war. They can't just keep lying to you that Ukraine is winning when it's not. The fake stories of Ukraine chasing the Russians out of Kyiv or the Ghost or Snake Island are getting a bit stale.
They are betting the farm on this one.
nan said:
They need the optics of Ukraine winning something so they can justify spending more money on this loser of a war. They can't just keep lying to you that Ukraine is winning when it's not. The fake stories of Ukraine chasing the Russians out of Kyiv or the Ghost or Snake Island are getting a bit stale.
They are betting the farm on this one.
I think the world would prefer Putin stop destroying a sovereign nation- PERIOD!
Do you have proof that Russia didn’t invade Ukraine?
One of their primary objectives is denazification- what percentage have they achieved to date? How do they assess this?
jamie said:
nan said:
They need the optics of Ukraine winning something so they can justify spending more money on this loser of a war. They can't just keep lying to you that Ukraine is winning when it's not. The fake stories of Ukraine chasing the Russians out of Kyiv or the Ghost or Snake Island are getting a bit stale.
They are betting the farm on this one.
I think the world would prefer Putin stop destroying a sovereign nation- PERIOD!
Do you have proof that Russia didn’t invade Ukraine?
One of their primary objectives is denazification- what percentage have they achieved to date? How do they assess this?
Much, if not most, of the world is more on Russia's side than ours. They know that a proxy war means that someone's sovereignty has already been compromised.
Russia did invade Ukraine and now we have this terrible war where so many innocent people are slaughtered.
It was SOOOOOOO avoidable. The West wanted it to happen because they wanted to get rid of Putin and get access to Russia as they did in the 1990s. They failed miserably and now the neocons don't have an off-ramp. So they are filling the money pit with cash and weapons, many of which end up who knows where. Meanwhile we have people working full time and living in cars while trying to get cancer treatments for their loved ones.
And the architects of this disaster want to do the same mistake all over again with China.
When will you get tired of listening to people who have a political death wish?
The West NEVER wanted this - this in itself is propaganda. Theduran guys are experts at pushing this narrative. But actual facts on the ground just aren't there.
The "architects of this disaster" are also a false narrative. Very similar to how you think we paint Russia as the "villain":
As I've repeated a thousand times - the Russian people are in almost as bad of a situation thanks to Vlad - Putin is the root of a lot of grief - for his country as well. Russian people are good - the dictator in charge suppressing them is a shame.
I'm glad you acknowledged the Russia invaded them - nice to hear some "truth" out of you once in awhile.
I might shut down this thread - because it's going to be a repeat of what's being said on several other threads about the "Special operation".
If Russia takes all of Ukraine and kills Zelensky - will you be happy and relieved that it's over? Or will you speak up and blame us when he proceeds to the Baltic states?
jamie said:
The West NEVER wanted this - this in itself is propaganda. Theduran guys are experts at pushing this narrative. But actual facts on the ground just aren't there.
The "architects of this disaster" are also a false narrative. Very similar to how you think we paint Russia as the "villain":
As I've repeated a thousand times - the Russian people are in almost as bad of a situation thanks to Vlad - Putin is the root of a lot of grief - for his country as well. Russian people are good - the dictator in charge suppressing them is a shame.
I'm glad you acknowledged the Russia invaded them - nice to hear some "truth" out of you once in awhile.
I might shut down this thread - because it's going to be a repeat of what's being said on several other threads about the "Special operation".
If Russia takes all of Ukraine and kills Zelensky - will you be happy and relieved that it's over? Or will you speak up and blame us when he proceeds to the Baltic states?
The West planned this--what they never wanted was for them to be owned by the Russians. They thought they would fold like a cheap suit.
Putin is popular in Russia. People criticize him plenty but they are glad to have him over a Western puppet like Yeltsin. Some of them are still traumatized by the 1990s. There is support for this "Special Operation" but they would like it to be over.
There mulitple people/groups who might want to kill Zelensky. Of course it will be blamed on the Russians. There are all kinds of things going on there where he tries to fire people and they don't get fired and then they get replaced, etc. As even NPR has reported, he's got lots of money in safe places and probably is hoping to retire to Miami, Florida sometime soon. Ukraine did not get to be the most corrupt country for nothing. Where is the accounting for all the money/weapons we have sent there? Do we have a clue where they all went? I don't think so.
Anyway, I don't think Russia wants all of Ukraine but they may get stuck with it. More likely it will be a rump state, cut off from the sea filled with far-right nutcases. Remember what happened to Libya after the US killed Gaddafi? It will be another big mess we don't clean up. I don't think Russia is on any world conquering land grab. They are forming alliances all over the world to create an alternative universe without us. They are moving on to live their best life. We blew it. The neocons would have you think otherwise and continue to push for zero diplomacy and more proxy and real wars. Time to read Smedley Butler's book, "War is a Racket."
nan said:
The West planned this--what they never wanted was for them to be owned by the Russians. They thought they would fold like a cheap suit.
Putin is popular in Russia. People criticize him plenty but they are glad to have him over a Western puppet like Yeltsin. Some of them are still traumatized by the 1990s. There is support for this "Special Operation" but they would like it to be over.
There mulitple people/groups who might want to kill Zelensky. Of course it will be blamed on the Russians. There are all kinds of things going on there where he tries to fire people and they don't get fired and then they get replaced, etc. As even NPR has reported, he's got lots of money in safe places and probably is hoping to retire to Miami, Florida sometime soon. Ukraine did not get to be the most corrupt country for nothing. Where is the accounting for all the money/weapons we have sent there? Do we have a clue where they all went? I don't think so.
Anyway, I don't think Russia wants all of Ukraine but they may get stuck with it. More likely it will be a rump state, cut off from the sea filled with far-right nutcases. Remember what happened to Libya after the US killed Gaddafi? It will be another big mess we don't clean up. I don't think Russia is on any world conquering land grab. They are forming alliances all over the world to create an alternative universe without us. They are moving on to live their best life. We blew it. The neocons would have you think otherwise and continue to push for zero diplomacy and more proxy and real wars. Time to read Smedley Butler's book, "War is a Racket."
100% russian propaganda.
Show us the plan by the west - who's the #1 person behind it?
Putin is popular - you'd be in jail if you didn't agree with this sentiment - or try to protest.
Glad you're covering for the Kremlin already if Zelensky dies. Your pal Jimmy already gave cover by calling him a NAZI.
LOL- Russia might get "Stuck" with Ukraine - it's now a consolation prize for invading?
Again - what is the current level of denazification? This war is 100% about NAZIS - this is how the INVADER (Vladimir Putin) FRAMED IT!
And what is your thought on Vlad making "Special operation" deaths a State Secret?
Has Russia ever done anything wrong in your mind?
Please share the NPR report about Zelensky having money in safe places.
jamie said:
100% russian propaganda.
Show us the plan by the west - who's the #1 person behind it?
Putin is popular - you'd be in jail if you didn't agree with this sentiment - or try to protest.
Glad you're covering for the Kremlin already if Zelensky dies. Your pal Jimmy already gave cover by calling him a NAZI.
LOL- Russia might get "Stuck" with Ukraine - it's now a consolation prize for invading?
Again - what is the current level of denazification? This war is 100% about NAZIS - this is how the INVADER (Vladimir Putin) FRAMED IT!
And what is your thought on Vlad making "Special operation" deaths a State Secret?
Has Russia ever done anything wrong in your mind?
Please share the NPR report about Zelensky having money in safe places.
I've been talking about the plan for months. It started in 2014 with the US backed coup and then instigating conflict in the Donbas and pestering Russia, etc. We go over this every day on MOL.
I don't think you go to jail in Russia if you say you don't like him on a survey. He's not that authoritarian. I think those are anonymous anyway. They do go up and down.
I had a talk with my 91 year old mother this morning who only listens to mainstream media and was a big Vote for Biden Get Rid of Trump fan. She was like, "Why are they spending so much money on that? Just let Russia have it. They had it before. Let them have it! I don't care!"
She did not get this from me because we usually talk with my sister also on the phone and she cuts off any politics. People are seeing what's going on in this country, how the government changes the definition of recession and says everything is fine and then sends these huge amounts of money to this country with Nazis -- my Jewish mother WAS aware of Ukraine's Nazi problem--not sure how--but, people are not up for all this cash going out to help this right-wing country that has nothing to do with us and has a well-known history of celebrating Nazis.
The Democrats better refocus their priorities or they will be toast. This war is going to hurt us more than Russia.
I don't know what's going on with the refusal to release death counts. Not a clue.
Here is the NPR report. I posted it before. Sometimes mainstream media surprises me.
Corruption concerns involving Ukraine are revived as the war with Russia drags on
nan said:
Corruption concerns involving Ukraine are revived as the war with Russia drags on
Please provide the quote that Zelensky has money in "safe places".
nan said:
I've been talking about the plan for months. It started in 2014 with the US backed coup and then instigating conflict in the Donbas and pestering Russia, etc. We go over this every day on MOL.
And every time you bring it up - we debunk it. Nuland handing out cookies - right?
nan said:
I don't know what's going on with the refusal to release death counts. Not a clue.
I'll tell you why - he doesn't want his fellow countrymen to know how many soldiers he's give a death sentence to. So many families have no idea about the fate of their sons.
nan said:
The Democrats better refocus their priorities or they will be toast. This war is going to hurt us more than Russia.
Could you imagine if they did nothing? There's no winning side in war. Which by way - Vlad is flattening a sovereign nation that he believes IS Russia. They haven't been shy about this fact. You on the other hand never repeat what they're actually saying in public and via his personal media machine.
nan said:
I had a talk with my 91 year old mother this morning who only listens to mainstream media and was a big Vote for Biden Get Rid of Trump fan. She was like, "Why are they spending so much money on that? Just let Russia have it. They had it before. Let them have it! I don't care!"
Nice , exactly what Vlad hoped by extending the conflict. I've been hoping someone within Russia had the ability to step up =- but one thing Vlad has excelled at is quashing any opposition and protesting. (and Freedom of Spee ch) (and Freedon of the Press).
jamie said:
Please share the NPR report about Zelensky having money in safe places.
nan said:
Here is the NPR report. I posted it before. Sometimes mainstream media surprises me.
Corruption concerns involving Ukraine are revived as the war with Russia drags on
You should read it. It doesn’t say what you claim it says “about Zelensky having money in safe places”.
jamie said:
nan said:
I've been talking about the plan for months. It started in 2014 with the US backed coup and then instigating conflict in the Donbas and pestering Russia, etc. We go over this every day on MOL.
And every time you bring it up - we debunk it. Nuland handing out cookies - right?
It's not debunked. You just say it is. It happened. Grow up.
Here are some links for Zelensky's private holdings as reported in the Pandora papers.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/10/09/russia-ukraine-jordan-lebanon-pandora-papers/
(WAPO behind paywall -- so I can't read but maybe you can)
https://www.axios.com/2021/10/05/pandora-papers-politicians-countries
Just Google "Pandora Papers" + Zelensky and you will find tons of links
Discussion about Kherson offensive. Mention of New York Times article on Russian dead and available troops. Mention of the Yale study on Russian economy affected by sanctions ("horrible methodology").
nan said:
Here are some links for Zelensky's private holdings as reported in the Pandora papers.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/10/09/russia-ukraine-jordan-lebanon-pandora-papers/
(WAPO behind paywall -- so I can't read but maybe you can)
https://www.axios.com/2021/10/05/pandora-papers-politicians-countries
Just Google "Pandora Papers" + Zelensky and you will find tons of links
I’m pretty sure this will be traced to some Russian propaganda machine.
putin has tons of properties “offshore” in the names of his concubines that he paid no taxes for.
Keep googling…this smells of rotting caviar…
nan said:
Discussion about Kherson offensive. Mention of New York Times article on Russian dead and available troops. Mention of the Yale study on Russian economy affected by sanctions ("horrible methodology").
would you ever expect, in a million years, that they would say the Yale study was valid?
no. because they're not objective "journalists". they're ideologues.
just the kind you love.
Jaytee said:
nan said:
Here are some links for Zelensky's private holdings as reported in the Pandora papers.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/10/09/russia-ukraine-jordan-lebanon-pandora-papers/
(WAPO behind paywall -- so I can't read but maybe you can)
https://www.axios.com/2021/10/05/pandora-papers-politicians-countries
Just Google "Pandora Papers" + Zelensky and you will find tons of links
I’m pretty sure this will be traced to some Russian propaganda machine.
putin has tons of properties “offshore” in the names of his concubines that he paid no taxes for.
Keep googling…this smells of rotting caviar…
In the interest of fairness, this is what the OCCRP says about Zelensky's offshore holdings.
eta - There were all kinds of stories that Zeklensky was a billionaire and that he bought a house in Miami for $30 million. These are false rumors. It's estimated by Forbes that Zelensky is worth $20-30 million. He accumulated his wealth from his time as a comedian on tv and also owned an interest in the tv company that carried his shows.
Before anyone tries to make a big deal about Zelensky's offshore holdings or his net worth of $20 -30 million, let's talk about how much Putin is worth, how he got it, and where its held.
eta - And yes, Zelensky just fired Ivan Bakanov as head of security services, who was a partner in the offshore holdings.
Jaytee said:
nan said:
Here are some links for Zelensky's private holdings as reported in the Pandora papers.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/10/09/russia-ukraine-jordan-lebanon-pandora-papers/
(WAPO behind paywall -- so I can't read but maybe you can)
https://www.axios.com/2021/10/05/pandora-papers-politicians-countries
Just Google "Pandora Papers" + Zelensky and you will find tons of links
I’m pretty sure this will be traced to some Russian propaganda machine.
putin has tons of properties “offshore” in the names of his concubines that he paid no taxes for.
Keep googling…this smells of rotting caviar…
This was widely reported in the mainstream news. I included links fro Aljazeera and the Washington Post. Only one of my links has Russian origin. You can google yourself.
This is not a fake--Zelensky was included in the Pandora papers. It's a fact.
cramer said:
Before anyone tries to make a big deal about Zelensky's offshore holdings or his net worth of $20 -30 million, let's talk about how much Putin is worth, how he got it, and where its held.
eta - And yes, Zelensky just fired Ivan Bakanov as head of security services, who was a partner in the offshore holdings.
So you are not going to have a problem with a comedian having that kind of money in non-disclosed locations? He lied about this when he ran for President. And he had his business partner as head of his security services.
OK.
Even NPR showed some concern.
drummerboy said:
nan said:
Discussion about Kherson offensive. Mention of New York Times article on Russian dead and available troops. Mention of the Yale study on Russian economy affected by sanctions ("horrible methodology").
would you ever expect, in a million years, that they would say the Yale study was valid?
no. because they're not objective "journalists". they're ideologues.
just the kind you love.
Can you please give me a list of objective journalists? Fun Fact: They don't exist.
Why do you think they are ideologues? That's harsh. I did not even know you listened to any of their videos.
If you remember from our discussion about that report the other day, even non-economists with different views such as PVW and myself noticed that they used non-standard measures. I gave it to a friend to look at and he (background in Statistics, Quant, Economics) immediately said it looked like propaganda. He said it looked like it was written by a committee and that the people who wrote it did not have the kind of background you would expect to be able to write something like that. He has not had time to look closely though.
So, you can stop the insults and start defending this paper that you insist is based on facts, despite the fact that you had not even read it and did not know how many pagers it contained.
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It feels to me that Kherson will be very pivotal for the future on this invasion.
Russia is pretty much declaring that there are already agreements in place.
https://ria.ru/20220730/deklaratsiya-1806111147.html
Kherson region adopted a development declaration on the future together with Russia
Looking at it - I don't think there will be referendums. Russia will simply claim it's theirs.
Here's more on the Public forum:
https://newsunrolled.com/world/70667.html
All of these news stories use RIA as their source. The propaganda campaign is strong.
Whereas - Ukraine has warned Russia its forces will be “annihilated” if they don’t retreat from the southern city of Kherson.
------------------------
If Ukraine successfully disables the bridges - it will be much harder for Russia to fully maintain control over this region.
I have to say - I'm not a big fan of Vladimir Salvo - the mayor of Kherson. He has had zero issues with Russia's invasion. And is pretty much in charge of the region now - on Russia's behalf. He was one of the first in line to get a new Russian passport.
On June 6 TASS reported: The Kherson Region in southern Ukraine is under full control of Russian forces, and life is gradually returning to normal there.
Time will tell.