Correct pronunciation of Italian words archived

It's a regional dialect in Italy. I believe it is form the south west coastal area. I had a very Italian freind, Augusta, who spoke of "pasta fajool" etc.

I can't stand the American pronunciations of Italian and Spanish words. La Mesa, TX is known as "La Meesa" to all Texans and the VIllage Trattoria is called the Trat- TOR - ia by most Maplewoodians.

Kmk - when I pronounced Trattoria differently, my Italian friends mocked me mercilessly. How do you pronounce it?

I am not to good at putting this down phonetically but this is close:

Trat(pause)-tor-RIA

I chuckle because Italian-American pronunciations and Italian pronunciations are completely different!

We always say trat-or-REEAH.

I have no idea if that's correct.

You have a similar pronunciation to mine.
It's when folks rhyme it with "Astoria" that I cringe.

it's properly pronounced:

"pick up da-mootz at Lisa's awready."

KMK, agreed.

I have never pronounced trattoria like Astoria, and I've never heard anyone else do it either.

Do people really do that?

Yeah - my Italian friend from Staten Island and all of her extended family! No kidding!

Italian friend from Staten Island (or as my friends in college called it -- Staten Italy)...thats sort of redundant. :smile:

I always thought the proper Maplewood pronunciation was -

trot-a-REE-a.

i lived in italy with a family who spoke no english. They are incapable of ending a word in a consonant. I can't stand the butchering that americans have done to the beautiful italian language.

nohero, 'you done good.'

allora

bene.

Both of my maternal and paternal grandparents are from Italy and we always say ri-'kot. And of course gravy instead of sauce, etc., My mother's side of the family is from Naples so I have to assume it is Italian as my grandmother, never learned English.

Posted By: noherotrot-a-REE-a.

That's what I meant, even though I couldn't spell it out correctly!

Hank, do we know KMK's friend who says it that way?

shh,

theres a good chance one of us is related to her friend, depending on if they were pre- or post-bridge, of course. Fuhgeddabodit!

By the way, the pronunciations are just a combination of bad translation combined with dialect combined with various education levels combined with linguistic laziness with how formal or colloquial someone was speaking. On my old block growing up, Id listen to my father and other neighbors who were the sons of Italian immigrants speaking Italian with the old Italian men and women. I didnt know exactly what they were saying but the conversation sounded like all different languages depending on where the person's family originated from. One old Italian lady who was from farther north in Italy used to laugh, between the way these guys butchered the language and the way the dialects varied from how she spoke Italian. I suppose its like having a conversation with different people from different parts of the US and different levels of education. All those things factor in...then you eventually get traditional but bastardized pronunciations for manicotti.

Posted By: hankzonaI suppose its like having a conversation with different people from different parts of the US and different levels of education. All those things factor in...then you eventually get traditional but bastardized pronunciations for manicotti.

Actually it's much worse(?) than that, because the Italian dialects are often different enough from one another that they're really separate languages. Most modern Italians are taught standard Italian in school, and more and more it's replacing the old dialects, but you can expect that the Italian immigrants to the states back 100 years ago didn't learn them. Naturally this led to various simplifications and modifications to the language they spoke.

Then, as others have said, add in non-native speakers and their poor ear for the language.

I grew up with native Italian parents and a grandmother and I cannot stand to hear the murdering of such a beautiful language. It is (with rolling r's) Moat zah rella, Ree cotta, parmeegianna, pro shooto, mah ni coatee.. etc.

Makes me want to sing opera!!! All of those open ended words just linger ....
Figaro, Figaro, FEEEE- garo!

The shortened pronunciations are definitely not way these items would be pronounced in Italy. I've studied the language and visited there several times and grew up in a household with grandparents from the area of Italy near Genoa. The "ri-kot"/"pro'zhut" etc. pronunciations were much more commonly used by people who emmigrated from the area of Naples and further south in Italy. It's also become sort of bastardized by being repeated here by those who don't really speak Italian.

And also, when the majority of Italians left Italy, the language was much more regionalized. Television has become the great equalizer in Italy, too, just as it is erasing many regional dialects here in the U.S. My dad's family was from Calabria and I could never understand a word they said when we visited them because their accent was so different from that I was used to from the grandparents I grew up with.

Italian is usually a lyrical language, with liquid "l"s and a musical cadence (unless you're listening to a soccer game on RAI where it's typically rapid-fire sportspeak). "CH" should be pronounced as is "K" in English, "CE" as "CHAY" and "CI" as "CHEE". But many, many Italians don't pronounce their own surnames correctly any more. Much of that might be due to the push to become "Americanized" back in the 1930s - 1950s.

And sadly, the rules of pronunciation are consistent and BARELY harder than those of Spanish. But people seem to think it's hard. It's not!

Speaking of peeves, how about the way people butcher Italian names? Like someone named Pignatello (pronounced properly as PEEN ya tell(pause) lo) instead as PIG na tello. Ughhhhhhh.

Anyone who understands italian and wants to seriously laugh needs to look at this Rosina and Pasquale Skit

http://www.mindofchester.com/blog/mediainfo.cfm?animID=18

I lived in Verona (northern Italy) for 4 years and have returned several times. I spent 5 weeks traveling as far south as the Amalfi Coast a few years ago. I speak Italian (learned in Italy) well enought to have a great conversation with a cab driver but not well enough to discuss - say philosophy. I never heard any Italian anywhere in Italy cut off the consonants of any words. The Italians tend to speak very fast, you wonder how they manage all those syllables in so little time. Also, they tend speak with a very quick staccato pause between each sylable.

Piano in American: Peeeaaaano

Piano in Italian: Pi ah no (actualy meens quiet or soft)

My fathers' parents came from Calabria, My Mother's from Avilino and Forgiano, considered part of Naples. They spoke two different dialects my father had to learn my mother's dialect, as her father did not speak much English and her mother spoke none.

Fra-GEE-lay!

It is Trah TOR ia. NOT trattorEA!!!!!!

(from Merimam-Webster.com)

Main Entry:
trat·to·ria Listen to the pronunciation of trattoria
Pronunciation:
\?trä-t?-?r?-?\
Function:
noun
Inflected Form(s):
plural trat·to·ri·as or trat·to·rie Listen to the pronunciation of trattorie \-?r?-??\

sorry, tried to edit that before I sent it........


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/trattoria