Who Has Worse Voice, Dylan or Leonard Cohen?

yahooyahoo said:

HatsOff said:

As I've mulled this over, over a few days, one thing occurs to me though. Are there any female poet/singers with terrible voices who get away with the bad voice thing?

Yoko Ono.

Horrendous singer.

She didn’t exactly get away with it, though, did she.


HatsOff said:

Agree to this. Of the two, I like Cohen a lot and dislike Dylan (though some of his songs covered by others are OK) but I think they both have terrible voices. Same with Neil Young mentioned above - love him despite his voice. (which I've always wondered if maybe it is a stylistic choice?)

As I've mulled this over, over a few days, one thing occurs to me though. Are there any female poet/singers with terrible voices who get away with the bad voice thing? I can't think of any. I don't think that means that there has never been a woman who could plausibly be in that category - just that they don't get airtime. Or maybe I just can't think of any.

I'm open to being convinced I'm wrong.

 I think some people might put Patti Smith in that category. Personally I don't dislike her voice. But I doubt anyone would describe her as a beautiful singer. 


ml1 said:

 I think some people might put Patti Smith in that category. Personally I don't dislike her voice. But I doubt anyone would describe her as a beautiful singer. 

I'll buy that. I do like Patti Smith but her voice is definitely not beautiful. Not quite as gawd-awful as the men listed above but is a check mark in the column, at least.


ml1 said:

ridski said:

 John Lydon.

 really?
John's a great singer. Totally unique. And funny 

 He's a great vocalist.


ridski said:

 He's a great vocalist.

 don't make me ask that guy to go to dictionary.com on you!


I think people here are missing the point of Cohen's voice.  If he was singing holiday standards, sure, his voice would be awful but there's not a better voice in the world for the material that he sang.

Dylan's songs, on the other hand, are almost always better when being covered by a talented singer and/or accompanied by a minimally competent harmonica player.


Klinker said:

I think people here are missing the point of Cohen's voice. 

It’s a point, but not an objective one. There are plenty of cover vocals that I prefer to Cohen’s originals, and I find Dylan’s singing, like Al Kooper’s DIY organ on Like a Rolling Stone [ETA: corrected from the wrong song], a good match for his music.

Then again, contra cuethesun, I also like Alan Wilson’s voice. (But Frankie Valli? Hell no.)


DaveSchmidt said:

It’s a point, but not an objective one. There are plenty of cover vocals that I prefer to Cohen’s originals, and I find Dylan’s singing, like Al Kooper’s DIY organ on Rainy Day Women, a good match for his music.

Then again, contra cuethesun, I also like Alan Wilson’s voice. (But Frankie Valli? Hell no.)

 Well, there are also people who can't stand either and prefer the musical stylings of whoever is filling Justin Bieber's shoes these days. Its all subjective.


I had an argument with someone on this board who was adamant that The Beatles had terrible voices and Paul McCartney in particular had the most grating voice in popular music. Despite the fact that many, many people would consider The Beatles' voices in three-part harmony to be among the most beautiful instruments in rock or pop. 

Different strokes...


I think this vocal is pretty good. 



HatsOff said:

Are there any female poet/singers with terrible voices who get away with the bad voice thing? I can't think of any. I don't think that means that there has never been a woman who could plausibly be in that category - just that they don't get airtime. 

Marianne Faithfull?

Bonnie Raitt?

Janis Joplin?

Cyndi Lauper?

Tina Turner? Not a traditionally "beautiful" voice, but I just watched a video of her performing Proud Mary Live at Wembley Stadium in 2014. How the hell does she do it?

Melissa Etheridge?

I never thought Madonna had much of a voice. Thin and reedy.

Anyway, female singers are expected to have a normal good voice but also to be thin and beautiful, which is why there are so few famous female vocalists. Are there any female poet/singers who are equal in looks to Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen? (Yes, Janis Joplin. Anyone else?)  

Can you name any fat white female vocalists besides Adele, Nancy Wilson, and Mama Cass? It takes an extraordinary voice to achieve fame while fat, white, and female.


kthnry said:

Can you name any fat white female vocalists besides Adele, Nancy Wilson, and Mama Cass? It takes an extraordinary voice to achieve fame while fat, white, and female.

I have long been in love with Alison Moyet. Not just her angelic voice, but as in, I would marry her in love with.

(And you probably meant Ann Wilson, yes?)


kthnry said:

Marianne Faithfull?

Bonnie Raitt?

Janis Joplin?

Cyndi Lauper?

Tina Turner? Not a traditionally "beautiful" voice, but I just watched a video of her performing Proud Mary Live at Wembley Stadium in 2014. How the hell does she do it?

Melissa Etheridge?

I never thought Madonna had much of a voice. Thin and reedy.

Anyway, female singers are expected to have a normal good voice but also to be thin and beautiful, which is why there are so few famous female vocalists. Are there any female poet/singers who are equal in looks to Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen? (Yes, Janis Joplin. Anyone else?)  

Can you name any fat white female vocalists besides Adele, Nancy Wilson, and Mama Cass? It takes an extraordinary voice to achieve fame while fat, white, and female.

I'm not going to deny that the women you mention don't have beautiful voices. However, I would posit that they all can sing - and some can SING. Janis Joplin & Tina Turner, I'm looking at you. I'd give my right arm to be able to sing like any of them. And having said that, I may need to re-think Patti Smith, who also could sing. (Marianne Faithfull I'll have to get back to you on - I haven't heard anything of hers for a long time, but the others show up occasionally-to-often on my playlist, except Cyndi Lauper who I generally can't stand but I certainly do remember what she sounds like.)

And by this I mean that they used their voices intentionally and even masterfully for a specific effect. Whereas singing is mostly an afterthought for Cohen (especially) and Dylan (to an extent). And I add again that I really like Cohen, but have never been a fan of Dylan. As others have said, the singing is beside the point for these guys. Any of their work could be read as poetry, and/or works better when others cover it.

EDITED to add that I just noticed I used the present tense above when some of these people are sadly not singing any more - but they're still present-tense to me ...


The only one of those women I'd put in the Cohen/Dylan category is Marianne Faithfull.  And I like her voice, despite the rasp.



Love Dylan, love his unique voice, his style and his poetry. Blood on the Tracks one of his best albums.

And love listening to both Joplin and Bonnie Raitt.

There's a nasal quality that sounds appealingly unrefined and passionate.


HatsOff said:

As I've mulled this over, over a few days, one thing occurs to me though. Are there any female poet/singers with terrible voices who get away with the bad voice thing? I can't think of any. I don't think that means that there has never been a woman who could plausibly be in that category - just that they don't get airtime. Or maybe I just can't think of any.

I'm open to being convinced I'm wrong.

 Kim Carnes


Train_of_Thought said:

kthnry said:

Can you name any fat white female vocalists besides Adele, Nancy Wilson, and Mama Cass? It takes an extraordinary voice to achieve fame while fat, white, and female.

I have long been in love with Alison Moyet. Not just her angelic voice, but as in, I would marry her in love with.

(And you probably meant Ann Wilson, yes?)

 Yes! Ann Wilson. I'm not familiar with Alison Moyet. Will check her out.


cramer said:

HatsOff said:

As I've mulled this over, over a few days, one thing occurs to me though. Are there any female poet/singers with terrible voices who get away with the bad voice thing? I can't think of any. I don't think that means that there has never been a woman who could plausibly be in that category - just that they don't get airtime. Or maybe I just can't think of any.

I'm open to being convinced I'm wrong.

 Kim Carnes

 Lucinda Williams. But again, she is sort of like Cohen.  Her voice adds value to her songs.


kthnry said:

Train_of_Thought said:

kthnry said:

Can you name any fat white female vocalists besides Adele, Nancy Wilson, and Mama Cass? It takes an extraordinary voice to achieve fame while fat, white, and female.

I have long been in love with Alison Moyet. Not just her angelic voice, but as in, I would marry her in love with.

(And you probably meant Ann Wilson, yes?)

 Yes! Ann Wilson. I'm not familiar with Alison Moyet. Will check her out.

Most know her for Yaz and their many hits. However here is one of my favorite solo vocals of hers.


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