Somewhat depressing article.  It doesn't help that there are people who call themselves "progressive" who are helping to buttress Trump like this.

If we could sit ordinary Trump voters down in a courtroom for days, many of them probably would follow the evidence and change their minds. But since public opinion and politics don’t work that way, it’s not even a good bet, much less a “safe” one, that Trump’s supporters will abandon him. Even that pro-Trump juror who voted to convict Manafort told Fox News that she still viewed the whole prosecution as a “witch hunt”: “Certainly Mr. Manafort got caught breaking the law, but he wouldn’t have gotten caught if they weren’t after President Trump.”

Will the truth about Trump ultimately bring him down? In the eyes of historians, probably yes—but in the meantime, his fate and the nation’s depend on politics, particularly the internal politics of the Republican Party. Until there are major Republican defections—and we have no sign of them yet—Trump will remain our president.

The recurring expectation of Trump’s imminent political demise may have its deepest roots in a certain kind of American exceptionalism—a belief that “it can’t happen here,” that Trump does not truly represent “who we are,” and that our fellow citizens will surely come to the realization that a man so manifestly dishonorable and deceitful is unfit to be president of the United States.

But it is time to give up these illusions. The truth does not always prevail, and Americans are as susceptible to demagoguery as the people of other countries. We may have thought our institutions protected us from that fate, but now we should know better. Steeled with that realism, we ought to be prepared for the difficult fight ahead. 

there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

 If you took a survey of Trump supporters and asked "Should Hillary Clinton be impeached"? What % would say "yes"?

ml1 said:
I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

 Not all progressives.

Just the ones who adopt the Trumpist views of the Mueller investigation (see, e.g., Glenn Greenwald and his assorted hangers-on, toadies and fanboys).  They reinforce the views of the Trump voters that it's a "witch hunt".

nohero said:

ml1 said:
I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

 Not all progressives.
Just the ones who adopt the Trumpist views of the Mueller investigation (see, e.g., Glenn Greenwald and his assorted hangers-on, toadies and fanboys).  They reinforce the views of the Trump voters that it's a "witch hunt".

 so perhaps 0.0000001% of progressives are to blame.

ml1 said:

 so perhaps 0.0000001% of progressives are to blame.

Good news for progressives! There are at least a billion of them.

nohero said:

ml1 said:
I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

 Not all progressives.
Just the ones who adopt the Trumpist views of the Mueller investigation (see, e.g., Glenn Greenwald and his assorted hangers-on, toadies and fanboys).  They reinforce the views of the Trump voters that it's a "witch hunt".

There you go with your McCarthyism -- those who challenge the Mueller "investigation" -- like Glenn Greenwald -- have adopted "Trumpist views."

Here's Glenn's latest. Is it "Trumpist" or legitimate criticism of the media?

https://theintercept.com/2018/08/28/cnn-credibly-accused-of-lying-to-its-audience-about-a-key-claim-in-its-blockbuster-cohen-story-refuses-to-comment/

DaveSchmidt said:

ml1 said:

 so perhaps 0.0000001% of progressives are to blame.

Good news for progressives! There are at least a billion of them.

 it's a big world

paulsurovell said:

nohero said:

ml1 said:
I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

 Not all progressives.
Just the ones who adopt the Trumpist views of the Mueller investigation (see, e.g., Glenn Greenwald and his assorted hangers-on, toadies and fanboys).  They reinforce the views of the Trump voters that it's a "witch hunt".

There you go with your McCarthyism -- those who challenge the Mueller "investigation" -- like Glenn Greenwald -- have adopted "Trumpist views."
Here's Glenn's latest. Is it "Trumpist" or legitimate criticism of the media?
https://theintercept.com/2018/08/28/cnn-credibly-accused-of-lying-to-its-audience-about-a-key-claim-in-its-blockbuster-cohen-story-refuses-to-comment/

 Challenging the Mueller investigation as a "witch hunt" and adopting the Nunes/Hannity arguments is adopting the Trumpist view.  The attempts to rationalize doing that are very lame.  That's the truth, and shrieking "That's McCarthyism" is even more lame.

ml1 said:

nohero said:

ml1 said:
I'm not understanding how this is the fault of progressives. 

 Not all progressives.
Just the ones who adopt the Trumpist views of the Mueller investigation (see, e.g., Glenn Greenwald and his assorted hangers-on, toadies and fanboys).  They reinforce the views of the Trump voters that it's a "witch hunt".

 so perhaps 0.0000001% of progressives are to blame.

 However many there are, and wherever they may be spotted.

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

If this is really news to you perhaps you should widen your news sources beyond just the ones that parrot back what you believe...

In the meantime if you really need names possibly the Jimmy Kimmel people might share some with you...?

Scully said:

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

If this is really news to you perhaps you should widen your news sources beyond just the ones that parrot back what you believe...
In the meantime if you really need names possibly the Jimmy Kimmel people might share some with you...?

 You get your news from Jimmy Kimmel?

lord_pabulum said:

Scully said:

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

If this is really news to you perhaps you should widen your news sources beyond just the ones that parrot back what you believe...
In the meantime if you really need names possibly the Jimmy Kimmel people might share some with you...?

 You get your news from Jimmy Kimmel?

I don’t, but I got five answers to author’s request out of the Kimmel video that ml1 posted here yesterday. Do you think it’s possible those are the people Scully was referring to?

DaveSchmidt said:

lord_pabulum said:

Scully said:

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

If this is really news to you perhaps you should widen your news sources beyond just the ones that parrot back what you believe...
In the meantime if you really need names possibly the Jimmy Kimmel people might share some with you...?

 You get your news from Jimmy Kimmel?

I don’t, but I got five answers to author’s request out of the Kimmel video that ml1 posted here yesterday. Do you think it’s possible those are the people Scully was referring to?

Given the 'sample' used on the show, anybody watching would easily assume the average american is an idiot.  There are also people who believe Trump is a nazi, BHO was a naturalized citizen and that corporations are people.  Pretty much idiots everywhere.

I don't believe Trump is a Nazi but he is an economic Fascist. And on top of it all, the trains ain't even running on time.

I believe Trump thinks there are Nazis who are very fine people 

lord_pabulum said:

Pretty much idiots everywhere.

But contrary to your question’s implication, maybe not Scully.

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
I don't believe Trump is a Nazi but he is an economic Fascist. And on top of it all, the trains ain't even running on time.

 What's an 'economic fascist'?

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
I don't believe Trump is a Nazi but he is an economic Fascist. And on top of it all, the trains ain't even running on time.

 I don't believe Trump is a Nazi. But I'm also not 100% sure that he is NOT a Nazi. 

lord_pabulum said:

DaveSchmidt said:

lord_pabulum said:

Scully said:

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

If this is really news to you perhaps you should widen your news sources beyond just the ones that parrot back what you believe...
In the meantime if you really need names possibly the Jimmy Kimmel people might share some with you...?

 You get your news from Jimmy Kimmel?

I don’t, but I got five answers to author’s request out of the Kimmel video that ml1 posted here yesterday. Do you think it’s possible those are the people Scully was referring to?

Given the 'sample' used on the show, anybody watching would easily assume the average american is an idiot.  There are also people who believe Trump is a nazi, BHO was a naturalized citizen and that corporations are people.  Pretty much idiots everywhere.

 Supreme Court confirmed that corporations are people, despite obvious reasons why they are not.

yahooyahoo said:

 Supreme Court confirmed that corporations are people, despite obvious reasons why they are not.

Yes, SCOTUS decided that corporations are entitled to enjoy most of the same rights as enjoyed by natural persons such as the 14th amendment’s due process clause.  See Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Co., 118 U.S. 394 (1886).  However, this case is more than 125 years old.  It is ancient history.

Interesting aside:  the above case does not explicitly deal with constitutional rights of corporations or corporate personhood.  Instead, the issue is taken up in the headnote (which is not written be the Court and is written by a representative of the publishing company).  I have set forth the relevant headnote as follows:

One of the points made and discussed at length in the brief of counsel for defendants in error was that 'corporations are persons within the meaning of the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States.' Before argument, Mr. Chief Justice Waite said: The court does not wish to hear argument on the question whether the provision in the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution,, which forbids a State to deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws, applies to these corporations. We are all of the opinion that it does.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Clara_County_v._Southern_Pacific_Railroad_Co.

I thought yahoo was referring to Citizens United.

author said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
there are still dillwads that think Hillary should be impeached.

 Kindly name a few.

dave23 said:
I thought yahoo was referring to Citizens United.

 I believe so.  I was too.

The case cited by RFA is the initial precedent on which the Citizens United Court relied.

I would argue that a corporation has the same rights as a human with respect to due process. A corporation cannot be deprived of its property or subject to criminal prosecution which could result in substantial monetary penalties without due process of law.

Very different than the Hobby Lobby case which seems to say that a corporation has Freedom of Religion.

lord_pabulum said:

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
I don't believe Trump is a Nazi but he is an economic Fascist. And on top of it all, the trains ain't even running on time.

 What's an 'economic fascist'?

 All (or as much as possible) government economic support is focused on business and industry. Trump focuses his economic programs to benefit business and industry but also adds support for the wealthy.

The betterment of the nation comes from economic planning by government AND corporations. 

Another term for fascism, as it was promoted in the U.S., was corporatism. 

Corporatism is now implemented by Congress and K Street.

LOST said:
The case cited by RFA is the initial precedent on which the Citizens United Court relied.
I would argue that a corporation has the same rights as a human with respect to due process. A corporation cannot be deprived of its property or subject to criminal prosecution which could result in substantial monetary penalties without due process of law.
Very different than the Hobby Lobby case which seems to say that a corporation has Freedom of Religion.





What were we taking about again?

 yahooyahoo: " Supreme Court confirmed that corporations are people" is roughly the holding for the Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Co. case.  Whereas, the holding for Citizens United is more along the lines of: "the free speech clause of the First Amendment to the Constitution prohibits the government from restricting independent expenditures for communications by nonprofit corporations, for-profit corporations, labor unions, and other associations."  

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._FEC

IOW, Citizens United holding is NOT responsible for the proposition that corporations have the same, or most of the same, constitutional rights, as natural persons.  The Santa Clara County case of more than 125 years ago is responsible for that bit of jurisprudence.