So Much for "Unity" at the DNC: Corporate Democrats Purge Bernie Backers

Nancy

The Democrats would rather lose Republicans than allow Progressive to win or, it seems, even be on a committee.  Turns out only a few people get to see the DNC budget.  When you give them money, you never get to see how it is used.


bets

Maybe it's because HE'S NOT A DEMOCRAT?!?!!!???


Nancy

He's more of a Democrat than the Republican Lite that passes for Democrat now.  He wants the party to get back to the FDR tradtional base. He's the most popular politician in the country.  You would think they would want to adopt his very popular policies.  But, no they would rather keep taking the donor cash and lose. 


drummerboy

Not to say I'm supporting the actions of the DNC here, but it's kind of notable that some of the people who are being "purged" have been there for many years - years which I bet you thought the DNC did a pretty sucky job, of which these folks were part.

You can say they they're being let go because they supported Bernie - but maybe they're being let go because they've been ineffective?


nan said:

He's more of a Democrat than the Republican Lite that passes for Democrat now.  He wants the party to get back to the FDR tradtional base. He's the most popular politician in the country.  You would think they would want to adopt his very popular policies.  But, no they would rather keep taking the donor cash and lose. 



Nancy

No, watch the video.  They were specifically let go because they support Bernie and/or Keith Ellison.  They want to keep the rules the same.  The DNC thinks they are ineffective because they want change.


Nancy

This video goes into more detail:



drummerboy

no offense intended, but the videos you post from these folks are so tedious. Plus they are so-o-o-o-oo slanted.

Maybe you can point to a particular segment in the video that proves your point.

Anyway - if you think the DNC has done a crappy job for the last x years, don't you want a cleanup? These people have been in there for years - maybe their hearts are in the right place, but they're clearly ineffective. Merely supporting Bernie does not automatically make them effective within the DNC.



kibbegirl

There is no such thing of "He's more of a Democrat..." than an actual Democrat. Face it. He's NOT a Democrat and he is proud that he is not and runs on the fact that he isn't. I didn't watch the video so not sure of the infighting b'twn Bernie and Keith but I will ask, 'Why fight with a person who isn't in your party and has demonstrated numerous times that he is for he and he alone?' And in closing...he's NOT a Democrat. 


librarylady

As Kibbegirl says, he is NOT a Democrat !!


Bernie Sanders Won't Become a Democrat, Will Run as an Independent in 2018



http://www.newsweek.com/bad-news-democrats-sanders-confirms-he-will-run-independent-2018-690953


yahooyahoo

It always seemed like Bernie supporters felt the DNC should just hand over the nomination to an Independent. 

bets said:

Maybe it's because HE'S NOT A DEMOCRAT?!?!!!???



drummerboy

To say nothing of all of the Bernie supporters who still think the DNC stole the nomination for Hillary.

yahooyahoo said:

It always seemed like Bernie supporters felt the DNC should just hand over the nomination to an Independent. 
bets said:

Maybe it's because HE'S NOT A DEMOCRAT?!?!!!???

I just read an article that names some of the "lobbyists" that were named to these positions. Try as the author might to make them sound scary, it doesn't sound like much of anything. Lobbying is not an illegal or inherently immoral activity. It's the way citizens get to talk and try to persuade their representatives. Because many lobbyists are abusive does not mean they all are. One of the lobbyists being appointed was a lobbyist for Puerto Rico. Seems to me P.R. needs all of the lobbyists they can get.


Norman Bates

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat.  It could be argued both ways.  Certainly, some might contend that he tried to hijack the Democratic  party to serve as a vehicle for his own presidential aspirations so he is owed nothing...and that also may explain why Wasserman-Schultz justifiably felt greater allegiance to HRC.    Others could argue that he is trying to advance a more socially progressive agenda in the Democratic party but is being rejected by a coalition of the more moderate old guard (led by the Clintons) and the forces of identity politics.   Furthermore, the nomination of Donna Brazile, who acted in a professionally unethical manner in forwarding debate questions to HRC, for a position on the DNC Rules Committee is a particularly egregious move by Perez.    Either way, there are lifelong Democrats, myself among them, who now are asking themselves if the DNC still is the party that embodies their values and ideals....although the options are limited.


yahooyahoo

Brazile should be kicked out, no question.

The inherent risk of the DNC strategy is that Bernie's run as an Independent will pull millions of voters from the Democratic candidate and pave the way for Trump to get re-elected.

Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat.  It could be argued both ways.  Certainly, some might contend that he tried to hijack the Democratic  party to serve as a vehicle for his own presidential aspirations so he is owed nothing...and that also may explain why Wasserman-Schultz justifiably felt greater allegiance to HRC.    Others could argue that he is trying to advance a more socially progressive agenda in the Democratic party but is being rejected by a coalition of the more moderate old guard (led by the Clintons) and the forces of identity politics.   Furthermore, the nomination of Donna Brazile, who acted in a professionally unethical manner in forwarding debate questions to HRC, for a position on the DNC Rules Committee is a particularly egregious move by Perez.    Either way, there are lifelong Democrats, myself among them, who now are asking themselves if the DNC still is the party that embodies their values and ideals....although the options are limited.



Klinker


Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat. 

But the vast majority of his supporters are. For the Dems to decide that they don't need progressives is  political suicide.

This isn't about one man, it is about the conflict between the liberal and conservative wings of the party.


Nancy


drummerboy said:

no offense intended, but the videos you post from these folks are so tedious. Plus they are so-o-o-o-oo slanted.

Maybe you can point to a particular segment in the video that proves your point.

Anyway - if you think the DNC has done a crappy job for the last x years, don't you want a cleanup? These people have been in there for years - maybe their hearts are in the right place, but they're clearly ineffective. Merely supporting Bernie does not automatically make them effective within the DNC.

I post videos from a Progressive viewpoint--because I'm making the case for a progressive viewpoint.  All media has a bias.  CNN, MSNBC, etc.  are establishment views--they just are as slanted as what I post.  I usually can't post videos from them because they support the status quo which means they will ignore this information or present it mostly as the DNC adding diversity, which is how the DNC covers their tracks.  

I think it is obvious that the DNC has done  crappy job.  They made sure that Hillary was the candidate and she lost to an orange psycho and Democrats at every level were wiped out.  People are sick of neoliberal policies and bought politicians.  That's why they threw their lot in with Trump.  We have the richest nation in the world and half the people are poor.  We have the highest child poverty level.   The gap between rich and poor grew during Obma's reign and he let the bankers off the hood.  But, Tom Perez is busy adding more lobbyists.  

Once again--the people let go were all progressives.  Everyone on the main committee now is a Clinton supporter--and they are going to vote on rules for things like superdelegates, and taking money from corporations and who can see the budget. Things will remain the same and they will run HIllary 2.0 and lose again in 2020 and you will blame me and Susan Sarandon. 


Gary


yahooyahoo said:

Brazile should be kicked out, no question.

The inherent risk of the DNC strategy is that Bernie's run as an Independent will pull millions of voters from the Democratic candidate and pave the way for Trump to get re-elected.
Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat.  It could be argued both ways.  Certainly, some might contend that he tried to hijack the Democratic  party to serve as a vehicle for his own presidential aspirations so he is owed nothing...and that also may explain why Wasserman-Schultz justifiably felt greater allegiance to HRC.    Others could argue that he is trying to advance a more socially progressive agenda in the Democratic party but is being rejected by a coalition of the more moderate old guard (led by the Clintons) and the forces of identity politics.   Furthermore, the nomination of Donna Brazile, who acted in a professionally unethical manner in forwarding debate questions to HRC, for a position on the DNC Rules Committee is a particularly egregious move by Perez.    Either way, there are lifelong Democrats, myself among them, who now are asking themselves if the DNC still is the party that embodies their values and ideals....although the options are limited.

Right now what Bernie is running as an independent for is reelection to the Senate. But if he chooses to run for President as an independent in 2020 that will guarantee a Republican victory, even if the Republican candidate is Trump. But he knows that so is unlikely to do so.


Nancy


kibbegirl said:

There is no such thing of "He's more of a Democrat..." than an actual Democrat. Face it. He's NOT a Democrat and he is proud that he is not and runs on the fact that he isn't. I didn't watch the video so not sure of the infighting b'twn Bernie and Keith but I will ask, 'Why fight with a person who isn't in your party and has demonstrated numerous times that he is for he and he alone?' And in closing...he's NOT a Democrat. 

Most people are Independents now--it is short-sighted to exclude them.  Also, his policies and viewpoints are traditional Democrat.  Democrats like Obama and Clinton are more in line with traditional Republicans.  

You all need to read Thomas Frank's book, "Listen, Liberal"   https://www.amazon.com/Listen-Liberal-Happened-Party-People/dp/1250118131/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1508856404&sr=8-1&keywords=Listen+liberal


Nancy


Klinker said:



Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat. 

But the vast majority of his supporters are. For the Dems to decide that they don't need progressives is  political suicide.

This isn't about one man, it is about the conflict between the liberal and conservative wings of the party.

Yes, and progressives right now are feeling that the Dems don't want them or care.  I will be voting 3rd party no matter what monster the GOP runs.  I don't feel I have a choice.  I feel like they have told us all to leave.


Nancy


yahooyahoo said:

It always seemed like Bernie supporters felt the DNC should just hand over the nomination to an Independent. 
bets said:

Maybe it's because HE'S NOT A DEMOCRAT?!?!!!???

No Bernie supporters felt the DNC should be an objective body and help both candidates equally.  Wikileaks and the recent DNC lawsuit showed that they feel entitled to pick the candidate they want and screw everyone else.


Nancy


yahooyahoo said:

Brazile should be kicked out, no question.

The inherent risk of the DNC strategy is that Bernie's run as an Independent will pull millions of voters from the Democratic candidate and pave the way for Trump to get re-elected.
Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat.  It could be argued both ways.  Certainly, some might contend that he tried to hijack the Democratic  party to serve as a vehicle for his own presidential aspirations so he is owed nothing...and that also may explain why Wasserman-Schultz justifiably felt greater allegiance to HRC.    Others could argue that he is trying to advance a more socially progressive agenda in the Democratic party but is being rejected by a coalition of the more moderate old guard (led by the Clintons) and the forces of identity politics.   Furthermore, the nomination of Donna Brazile, who acted in a professionally unethical manner in forwarding debate questions to HRC, for a position on the DNC Rules Committee is a particularly egregious move by Perez.    Either way, there are lifelong Democrats, myself among them, who now are asking themselves if the DNC still is the party that embodies their values and ideals....although the options are limited.

Bernie ran as a Democrat for President.  I'm not sure what he will do next time.  He seems loyal to the Dems, despite the fact that they treat him and progressives like crap.  Many are urging him to run as an Independent, but no one knows what he will do at this point or if he is going to run. He does seem like he is gearing up for a run with some party.


Nancy


librarylady said:

As Kibbegirl says, he is NOT a Democrat !!



Bernie Sanders Won't Become a Democrat, Will Run as an Independent in 2018








http://www.newsweek.com/bad-news-democrats-sanders-confirms-he-will-run-independent-2018-690953

That is not for president.  


South

A news article with more details would be more useful than a video.  I admit I didn't watch the video, but looked as some articles.  I can't say there's a complete picture from those articles, about who is in and who is out, but apparently some people were shifted, some people were added, and it's not as simple as claimed.

drummerboy said:

no offense intended, but the videos you post from these folks are so tedious. Plus they are so-o-o-o-oo slanted.

Maybe you can point to a particular segment in the video that proves your point.

Anyway - if you think the DNC has done a crappy job for the last x years, don't you want a cleanup? These people have been in there for years - maybe their hearts are in the right place, but they're clearly ineffective. Merely supporting Bernie does not automatically make them effective within the DNC.



DaveSchmidt


South_Mountaineer said:

and it's not as simple as claimed.

INASAC. My new go-to shortcut for chat. Thanks.


dave23


nan said:

Yes, and progressives right now are feeling that the Dems don't want them or care.  I will be voting 3rd party no matter what monster the GOP runs.  I don't feel I have a choice.  I feel like they have told us all to leave.

Without even knowing who the Dem candidate is?


drummerboy


nan said:

Things will remain the same and they will run HIllary 2.0 and lose again in 2020 and you will blame me and Susan Sarandon. 

Hmmm, I wonder why I'll blame you?

nan said:
...
  I will be voting 3rd party no matter what monster the GOP runs.  I don't feel I have a choice.  I feel like they have told us all to leave.

Maybe this is the reason.  Any liberal who votes 3rd party is kind of clueless if they then are going to be upset that the Dem candidate couldn't win.

Hillary might have won if Jill Stein's supporters had voted for Hillary.

So yeah - you vote 3rd party I sure as hell will blame you.


Hahaha


nan said:



Klinker said:



Norman_Bates said:

I suppose whether the DNC should embrace Sanders' supporters is a valid question since he is not a Democrat. 

But the vast majority of his supporters are. For the Dems to decide that they don't need progressives is  political suicide.

This isn't about one man, it is about the conflict between the liberal and conservative wings of the party.

Yes, and progressives right now are feeling that the Dems don't want them or care.  I will be voting 3rd party no matter what monster the GOP runs.  I don't feel I have a choice.  I feel like they have told us all to leave.

This short-sighted, foot stomping approach isn't going to move anyone to listen or adapt. All the die hard Bernie=or-Bust supporters successfully accomplished is getting Trump elected. And shame on you for that.


South


DaveSchmidt said:



South_Mountaineer said:

and it's not as simple as claimed.

INASAC. My new go-to shortcut for chat. Thanks.

You're welcome, I think.

Here's an example of an article with less of a down view of the whole thing.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/18/16489504/democrats-perez-dnc-unity

A list of Perez’s choices, leaked to Vox, shows plenty progressives are sure to celebrate. The new committee includes more union representatives that at any point in the body’s recent history. The number of Native Americans and millennials has doubled, and the DNC added its first DREAMer — Ellie Perez of Arizona. Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN), the Sanders ally who lost the DNC chair race to Perez, also joins the DNC’s most-powerful body, the executive committee. So does Royce West, a Texas state senator who supported Ellison’s bid for the chair.
...
And it does appear clear that Perez made efforts to include the Sanders faction’s wishes with his new raft of appointments. There’s little clear evidence that the new rules members are “loyal” or tied to Clinton in a meaningful way. Moreover, Perez appointed Larry Cohen, a union leader who chairs the Bernie-linked Our Revolution PAC, to an at-large position, as well as former Sanders campaign aide Symone Sanders. And Sanders’s supporters will surely thrill to the high number of union leaders — the SEIU's Hector Figueroa; the UAW's Cindy Estrada; the AFL-CIO's Tefere Gebre — who were appointed to at-large positions.

Klinker


drummerboy said:



nan said:

Things will remain the same and they will run HIllary 2.0 and lose again in 2020 and you will blame me and Susan Sarandon. 



Hmmm, I wonder why I'll blame you?

nan said:
...
  I will be voting 3rd party no matter what monster the GOP runs.  I don't feel I have a choice.  I feel like they have told us all to leave.

Maybe this is the reason.  Any liberal who votes 3rd party is kind of clueless if they then are going to be upset that the Dem candidate couldn't win.

Hillary might have won if Jill Stein's supporters had voted for Hillary.

So yeah - you vote 3rd party I sure as hell will blame you.

Perhaps but that leaves us progressives who swallow our outrage and vote for conservative centrist after conservative centrist out in the cold.  You are, literally, taking my vote for granted.


Klinker

I do not know if I have it in me to vote for another Goldman Sachs centrist tool.  I guess we will find out.


Norman Bates

In my opinion, there are two groups on the edges of the Democratic party.  (1) On the right are moderates who share some similarities to Trump supporters in that they are frustrated with the "business as usual" mode of Washington politics and the related party machinations but recognized the dangers of a Trump presidency and reluctantly leaned to HRC in 2016.  (2) On the left are progressives who also share a disdain for Washington politics.  They view the Democratic party as a socially moderate organization dedicated to preserving its own power rather than embracing a more aggressive social justice agenda but leaned to HRC because she was endorsed by Sanders and a more viable candidate than Stein or someone else on the left.   

This is a time that the DNC should be making moves to draw as many voices "under the tent" as possible, not marginalizing others by affirming an uninspiring agenda of past campaigns, stacking the leadership with old school party insiders such as Harold Ickes and Donna Brazile, and actively rejecting anyone who fails the purity test.  The DNC is risking the loss of many members from both of these edge groups who will feel further marginalized and look to candidates who represent their interests and validate their concerns.  The "better vote for the Dem candidate because he/she is better than Trump" argument will not overcome the feeling of being rejected by the DNC. Just my two-cents...



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