Teaching Slavery at South Mountain, Jefferson also involved in poor implementation of teaching the subject.

MrSuburbs said:

spontaneous, that's the issue. Do you really think you can get a consensus on the proper way to teach slavery with "respect"?

That's what makes this discussion so miraculous. Because it would definitely be a miracle if all agreed on how slavery or ugly truths of history should be taught.

You're being obtuse.

Klinker said:

MrSuburbs said:

How do you teach about the Holocaust without it getting ugly?

Well, you could start by canceling the lesson plan where the kids pretend they are camp guards and select some of their classmates for the ovens.

This.

Because that's the part of the assignment that was objectionable and unacceptable. He wasn't trying to get the entire curriculum about Colonial America eliminated.

jimmurphy said:


The gentleman who publicized it to the masses selected only the slave auction poster images for his photographic collage.

It was not an arts and crafts project. It was a project on Colonial American history. All of the other options were written works. One option was the slave auction poster.

And for the record, I am not defending any element of the project. Just trying to set the record straight on what it was and what it was not.

What it was not is a "slavery project."

I took the word "project" out of the title since it seems to be more upsetting to you than the fact that the school had slave auction posters on public display in the halls for all students to see.

Of course now it is even more incendiary and less accurate.

How so? Were they not teaching slavery? Just because they were also teaching about colonialism doesn't mean that slavery was not one of the subjects the students were learning about.

Again, you have now posted three times about the title of this thread, being more concerned about that than how a very dark and harmful part of our history was given to young students in such an insensitive manner. Who cares that first and second graders of color saw posters with pictures they might identify with hanging in the halls advertising slaves for sale, the THREAD TITLE is upsetting.

Never said I was upset.

jimmurphy is correct about the rubric, which I copied and posted on FB. My son is in the class that did this, although he didn't do the poster. He wanted to, because it was less writing than the brochure. I made him do the brochure to practice. I think many other kids did the poster because it was easier than writing. Remember, they are kids. I think the biggest error there was the lack of explanation in the hallway. IThere is also a lot of mix and match confusion on this thread between these two distinct and different instances. The video at Jefferson was a whole other issue, apparently thought up and executed independently by kids.

In addition, my son is currently wrapping up a three page essay about the Montgomery bus boycott, so I would say that there is more to this topic in school than just what is talked about here.

jimmurphy said:

I too am surprised that it took so long for this issue to be discussed here.

I can state unequivocally though that at South Mountain this was not a "slavery project." I have see the rubric and it was a project regarding Colonial America. Making a slave auction poster was one of several options for the students to work on. Most did not.

The gentleman who publicized it to the masses selected only the slave auction poster images for his photographic collage.

It would be good if the thread title was changed. I can provide photos later today of the rubric and the entire bulletin board if people are interested.

*****

jimmurphy said:

It was not an arts and crafts project. It was a project on Colonial American history. All of the other options were written works. One option was the slave auction poster.

*****

jimmurphy said:

And for the record, I am not defending any element of the project. Just trying to set the record straight on what it was and what it was not.

What it was not is a "slavery project."

*****

jimmurphy said:

Of course now it is even more incendiary and less accurate.

*****

Sorry, I had trouble with the quote function when going from page one to page two.

If it were just one comment, I would understand, but you keep coming back again and again to how it wasn't a slave project, the thread title is inaccurate, etc. Why should the semantics of describing how slave auction posters and a live mock slave auction presented in an elementary school deserve more weight than the posters and actual mock auction themselves?

I can even understand giving the school system a pass on the mock auction since it wasn't on the lesson plan and it was a sub who was responsible (though I hope this sub has been taken off the call list for showing that they aren't capable of recognizing what is and isn't inappropriate to allow students to do in class).

spontaneous, I'm obtuse? So are you saying I'm annoying to you or I don't have a grasp of the subject matter of this discussion? Either way it's name calling, which is your opinion. Like everything you've been saying so far.

You're entitled to it and like Evelyn Beatrice Hall, I'll defend your right to say it.

Yes, you're being obtuse. Report me if you feel that is name calling.

While I don't think that we can get a consensus on how to teach the subject of slavery, I am pretty sure that most reasonable people would agree that slave auction posters lining the walls and/or mock slave auctions are good examples of lesson plans that are not good for young children. The subject is uncomfortable, we all agree on that. But the way this was handled wasn't just uncomfortable, it was extremely insensitive, which is the matter up for debate.

sprout said:

MrSuburbs said:

How do you teach about any of the horrific history that has been done to mankind without getting ugly?

To echo the others: Don't teach it via a re-enactment.

In 1968, A teacher performed an experiment on her elementary school class on the impact of designating a superior/inferior group based just on eye color, for just two days.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/a-class-divided/

Elliott divided her class by eye color -- those with blue eyes and those with brown. On the first day, the blue-eyed children were told they were smarter, nicer, neater, and better than those with brown eyes.

Throughout the day, Elliott praised them and allowed them privileges such as a taking a longer recess and being first in the lunch line. In contrast, the brown-eyed children had to wear collars around their necks and their behavior and performance were criticized and ridiculed by Elliott.

On the second day, the roles were reversed and the blue-eyed children were made to feel inferior while the brown eyes were designated the dominant group. What happened over the course of the unique two-day exercise astonished both students and teacher.

On both days, children who were designated as inferior took on the look and behavior of genuinely inferior students, performing poorly on tests and other work.

For a higher resolution of the Frontline epsode you can watch on YouTube:





Now that the impact is known, to do a similar experiment on children would likely require a human subjects review of the experiment, the debriefing process, and informed parental consent.

This sounds like an outstanding lesson.

spontaneous said:

Yes, you're being obtuse. Report me if you feel that is name calling.

While I don't think that we can get a consensus on how to teach the subject of slavery, I am pretty sure that most reasonable people would agree that slave auction posters lining the walls and/or mock slave auctions are good examples of lesson plans that are not good for young children. The subject is uncomfortable, we all agree on that. But the way this was handled wasn't just uncomfortable, it was extremely insensitive, which is the matter up for debate.

Which is again, all your opinion.

In response to MrSuburbs:

Everything should be put in its proper context.

Is it appropriate that the poster was one of the options - probably not. Is the Jefferson incident appropriate in any way - absolutely not.

But the representations here and on Facebook and the news skew things to the extreme, in my opinion. The teachers and administration appear to have been trying to introduce the most troubling aspect of our collective American history and put it in the context of Colonial times. Could it have been handled better in hindsight - yes.

But to focus on only the mistake in execution of a lesson rather than additionally what was trying to be accomplished is wrong. In my opinion.

Others obviously disagree.

FilmCarp said:

jimmurphy is correct about the rubric, which I copied and posted on FB. My son is in the class that did this, although he didn't do the poster. He wanted to, because it was less writing than the brochure. I made him do the brochure to practice. I think many other kids did the poster because it was easier than writing. Remember, they are kids. I think the biggest error there was the lack of explanation in the hallway. IThere is also a lot of mix and match confusion on this thread between these two distinct and different instances. The video at Jefferson was a whole other issue, apparently thought up and executed independently by kids.

In addition, my son is currently wrapping up a three page essay about the Montgomery bus boycott, so I would say that there is more to this topic in school than just what is talked about here.

I don't blame the kids at all. As you said, and I agree, they're kids. The kids in this class were presented with this as an option, so they would have no reason to think that they would be offered something that was wrong to do. My issue is that they were given the option of making the posters. As I already asked, would anyone be defending a project that had students making Nazi propaganda posters, even if it were "in context"?

I won't even blame the students at Jefferson. Again, they're kids. They haven't yet fully grasped the gravity of the subject, and will sometimes say or do things that are inappropriate just because they aren't fully mature yet. But for the sub to not shoot down the idea and to allow them to follow through was wrong and shows a serious lack of judgment.

If this exercise was invented by a sub, does anyone know if this person will be invited back to sub in the system? Have parents had the chance to ask him / her about the thought process of this lesson?

kibbegirl said:

If this exercise was invented by a sub, does anyone know if this person will be invited back to sub in the system? Have parents had the chance to ask him / her about the thought process of this lesson?

It's just a form of shallowness that is now taking over our culture. Its just shallow, low brow, ignorant hillbilly stuff.

My understanding is that the children themselves came up with the idea, not the sub. However, the sub didn't step in and say "No, that's not a good idea."

I am trying to recall the original story, but I don't believe the sub assigned or led this project. I think it occured in their classroom but the students came up with the idea, perhaps while working on a previously assigned subject. It should not have happened but it is important to get the facts straight during the discussion.

Since, they're two seperate incidents, I'll ask seperately. What's wrong with letting the class have a slave auction?

This history is fact. How can you possibly teach it without bringing it up?

We have a better chance at the future by telling the present the truth about the past.

MrSuburbs said:

Since, they're two seperate incidents, I'll ask seperately. What's wrong with letting the class have a slave auction?

This history is fact. How can you possibly teach it without bringing it up?

We have a better chance at the future by telling the present the truth about the past.

No one is saying it shouldn't be taught. No one is denying that it is a part of our history. What part of that do you not understand?

Race-based slavery and its successor, American apartheid, more than anything else, defined our development as a nation. It is difficult to imagine what kind of nation we would be absent race-based slavery. This needs to be the fundamental point our schools make. To me, mock slave auctions or slave posters trivialize this and make something awful into a game. Why not just have the kids quietly reflect on what it might be like to be forcibly taken from your family never to see them again or what it might be like to see a family member being whipped with no recourse? I realize that some of these concepts might be a bit much for elementary school, but some variation of this would be better than some of the activities the kids are asked to do.

MrSuburbs said:

Since, they're two seperate incidents, I'll ask seperately. What's wrong with letting the class have a slave auction?

This history is fact. How can you possibly teach it without bringing it up?

We have a better chance at the future by telling the present the truth about the past.

mcsuburbs, What's your ethnicity? Do you want to reenact Irish immigrants being discriminated against and told no Irish need apply? Or the labor riots where Irish immigrants were shot by govt troops? How about reenacting the murder of American Indian families in the French and idian War, or Jews being pushed into gas chambers or italians forming the mafia. Nice? Educational?

MrSuburbs said:

What's wrong with letting the class have a slave auction?

The rights listed below apply to adults participating in research studies, and there are even more stringent protections for children and pregnant women. These are guidelines for ethical treatment of human subjects. Holding a mock slave auction in class would fail to meet these ethical standards:

• Voluntary, informed consent
• Respect for persons: treated as autonomous agents
• The right to end participation in research at any time
• Right to safeguard integrity
• Benefits should outweigh cost
• Protection from physical, mental and emotional harm
• Access to information regarding research
• Protection of privacy and well-being

Blaming the sub is standard operating procedure. The sub will probably be fired and banned from working in the district again. His or her side of the story will not even be asked. Nothing makes you appreciate a union more than seeing how those who have no power are treated compared to those who have protection. Since we don't have the teacher's lesson plan, we cannot begin to know how this happened. The teacher was out due to dental surgery, so it was a planned absence and a lesson plan should have been in place. It was probably just one of those perfect storm bad days at the office for multiple people and unfortunately ended up on social media which made it the most bad day of all for some. In our district we try to teach about racism with more depth than other places so it's not surprising that sometimes it crosses some lines or seems that way. File under: better to have tried and failed than never to have tried at all.

nan said:

Blaming the sub is standard operating procedure. The sub will probably be fired and banned from working in the district again. His or her side of the story will not even be asked. Nothing makes you appreciate a union more than seeing how those who have no power are treated compared to those who have protection. Since we don't have the teacher's lesson plan, we cannot begin to know how this happened. The teacher was out due to dental surgery, so it was a planned absence and a lesson plan should have been in place. It was probably just one of those perfect storm bad days at the office for multiple people and unfortunately ended up on social media which made it the most bad day of all for some. In our district we try to teach about racism with more depth than other places so it's not surprising that sometimes it crosses some lines or seems that way. File under: better to have tried and failed than never to have tried at all.

Both the teacher and the district say that this was not in the lesson plan. Considering that the teacher reached out to parents once she found out about it but BEFORE this blew up, I'd say that I believe him/her.

MrSuburbs said:

What's wrong with letting the class have a slave auction?

I look forward to the class you will teach about the KKK. All of those 3rd graders will look so cute in their hats and robes.....

Seriously dude, this question..... I mean, if you have to ask.....

Play would appear to be an anomaly in the world of slavery. As an important
psychological activity it helped slave children in socialization and in the
acceptance of distressing situations through role play games such as slave
auction recreations. Denied the luxury of formal shop bought toys, slave
children improvised making houses out of tree and woodland materials, riding
stick horses, and dolls out of rags, wood and string.

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documents/education/childhood-slavery-contextual-essay.pdf

Dave - I found this document/essay very interesting.