Seth Boyden teacher accused of removing student's hijab during class

Full text of lawyer for teacher's statement: 

This is not a story about a teacher who forcibly removed a student’s hijab. This is a story about social media, misinformation, and what happens when people publicize rumors without any knowledge of or regard for the truth. Ms. Herman did not, as has been alleged, forcibly remove a student’s hijab or tell a student that she should not have to wear a hijab. In accordance with school policy, Ms. Herman directed a student in her class to pull down the hood on a hooded sweatshirt because it was blocking her eyes – and immediately rescinded that request when she realized that the student was wearing the hood in place of, rather than on top of, her usual hijab. The misinformation shared on social media has caused tremendous harm to Ms. Herman – a teacher who, after more than 30 years of devoting her heart and soul to children of all backgrounds, has now had to ask for police protection due to the doxxing and threats she has received following the dissemination of false information on social media. Governor Murphy even tweeted about it, sharing an article that was based entirely on the completely inaccurate, sensationalized story posted on Instagram by Olympic fencer Ibtihaj Muhammad. The fact that so many people seem to take at face value the idea that a veteran teacher (who has, in fact, taught numerous hijab-wearing students over the years) would forcibly remove a young girl’s hijab is deeply troubling and, I think, is reflective of the “shoot first, ask questions later” climate that all too frequently dominates social media and that causes so much unnecessary devastation.

https://villagegreennj.com/schools-kids/attorney-says-accused-south-orange-maplewood-teacher-did-not-remove-students-hijab/

cramer said:

Full text of lawyer for teacher's statement: 

This is not a story about a teacher who forcibly removed a student’s hijab. This is a story about social media, misinformation, and what happens when people publicize rumors without any knowledge of or regard for the truth. Ms. Herman did not, as has been alleged, forcibly remove a student’s hijab or tell a student that she should not have to wear a hijab. In accordance with school policy, Ms. Herman directed a student in her class to pull down the hood on a hooded sweatshirt because it was blocking her eyes – and immediately rescinded that request when she realized that the student was wearing the hood in place of, rather than on top of, her usual hijab. The misinformation shared on social media has caused tremendous harm to Ms. Herman – a teacher who, after more than 30 years of devoting her heart and soul to children of all backgrounds, has now had to ask for police protection due to the doxxing and threats she has received following the dissemination of false information on social media. Governor Murphy even tweeted about it, sharing an article that was based entirely on the completely inaccurate, sensationalized story posted on Instagram by Olympic fencer Ibtihaj Muhammad. The fact that so many people seem to take at face value the idea that a veteran teacher (who has, in fact, taught numerous hijab-wearing students over the years) would forcibly remove a young girl’s hijab is deeply troubling and, I think, is reflective of the “shoot first, ask questions later” climate that all too frequently dominates social media and that causes so much unnecessary devastation.

https://villagegreennj.com/schools-kids/attorney-says-accused-south-orange-maplewood-teacher-did-not-remove-students-hijab/

 UTTER BS. For this to have happened, the child would have had to tell the teacher she was wearing this in place of her hijab. The teacher did MORE than make a request. She even mentioned that while attempting to remove the hood she saw hair and stopped immediately . Bottom line is, she should have kept her hands to herself . 

In the attorney's letter posted directly above your statement, the teacher is reported to have said that she told the student to lower the hood of the hoodie and withdrew the request when she saw the student was not wearing a hijab under the hood.  In this account, the teacher did not touch the child or the hood.   This is a significant difference between the account circulating on some social media sites and the contents of the attorney's letter.  We need to wait for the results of the investigation to determine which version of the incident is correct.  Until then, we should not jump to conclusions.

School has been in sesssion for one month and presumably the student wore a hijab everday, but one day last week the teacher told the student to remove the hood  because the student has beautiful hair? 

cramer said:

School has been in sesssion for one month and presumably the student wore a hijab everday, but one day last week the teacher told the student to remove the hood  because the student has beautiful hair? 

To quote Judge Judy, "If it doesn't make sense, it's usually not true". 

Many aspects of this sad story do not make sense. 

Also this seems appropriate to watch now: 

joan_crystal said:

In the attorney's letter posted directly above your statement, the teacher is reported to have said that she told the student to lower the hood of the hoodie and withdrew the request when she saw the student was not wearing a hijab under the hood.  In this account, the teacher did not touch the child or the hood.   This is a significant difference between the account circulating on some social media sites and the contents of the attorney's letter.  We need to wait for the results of the investigation to determine which version of the incident is correct.  Until then, we should not jump to conclusions.

 She did more than tell. But let’s say we go with that theory. Who pulled the hijab down to expose her hair which allegedly prompted the teacher to rescind her request?

So I guess we should all blame Facebook for this entire thing.

After all that's what everyone in DC seems to be doing about everything.

Tall_Mocha said:

joan_crystal said:

In the attorney's letter posted directly above your statement, the teacher is reported to have said that she told the student to lower the hood of the hoodie and withdrew the request when she saw the student was not wearing a hijab under the hood.  In this account, the teacher did not touch the child or the hood.   This is a significant difference between the account circulating on some social media sites and the contents of the attorney's letter.  We need to wait for the results of the investigation to determine which version of the incident is correct.  Until then, we should not jump to conclusions.

 She did more than tell. But let’s say we go with that theory. Who pulled the hijab down to expose her hair which allegedly prompted the teacher to rescind her request?

 You seem to know the facts,  can you tell us?

Ironically, the surname of one of the Jewish members of this group is Wyatt.

https://patch.com/new-jersey/southorange/essex-county-sisterhood-seeks-strengthen-jewish-muslim-relations

Tall_Mocha said:

cramer said:

Full text of lawyer for teacher's statement: 

This is not a story about a teacher who forcibly removed a student’s hijab. This is a story about social media, misinformation, and what happens when people publicize rumors without any knowledge of or regard for the truth. Ms. Herman did not, as has been alleged, forcibly remove a student’s hijab or tell a student that she should not have to wear a hijab. In accordance with school policy, Ms. Herman directed a student in her class to pull down the hood on a hooded sweatshirt because it was blocking her eyes – and immediately rescinded that request when she realized that the student was wearing the hood in place of, rather than on top of, her usual hijab. The misinformation shared on social media has caused tremendous harm to Ms. Herman – a teacher who, after more than 30 years of devoting her heart and soul to children of all backgrounds, has now had to ask for police protection due to the doxxing and threats she has received following the dissemination of false information on social media. Governor Murphy even tweeted about it, sharing an article that was based entirely on the completely inaccurate, sensationalized story posted on Instagram by Olympic fencer Ibtihaj Muhammad. The fact that so many people seem to take at face value the idea that a veteran teacher (who has, in fact, taught numerous hijab-wearing students over the years) would forcibly remove a young girl’s hijab is deeply troubling and, I think, is reflective of the “shoot first, ask questions later” climate that all too frequently dominates social media and that causes so much unnecessary devastation.

https://villagegreennj.com/schools-kids/attorney-says-accused-south-orange-maplewood-teacher-did-not-remove-students-hijab/

 UTTER BS. For this to have happened, the child would have had to tell the teacher she was wearing this in place of her hijab. The teacher did MORE than make a request. She even mentioned that while attempting to remove the hood she saw hair and stopped immediately . Bottom line is, she should have kept her hands to herself . 

 yeah, your first sentence makes no sense.

Saw on the title that @cramer had posted, one of the posters I always find to be reasonable, so I read his post and decided to start from the beginning. As someone who taught for awhile, my immediate thought was that the teacher asked the student to take her hoodie down which is standard practice  during the school day.

As for FB, I'm tempted to take a peek but it adds more action to a post meant to stoke the fire of a cultural divide. I do my best to control my temper but  posts calling for violence against the teacher would have had me rolling up my sleeves. I may give in to temptation.

I see quite a few statements of regular posters here that I agree with, guess I'll have to scroll back and add a few likes.

As most of us agree its scary the way so many jump to conclusions. 

sbenois said:

 You seem to know the facts,  can you tell us?

 What difference would it make? 

Tall_Mocha said:

sbenois said:

 You seem to know the facts,  can you tell us?

 What difference would it make? 

 well, it would make no difference, since you don't know the facts, though you apparently think you do.

Tall_Mocha said:

 She did more than tell. But let’s say we go with that theory. Who pulled the hijab down to expose her hair which allegedly prompted the teacher to rescind her request?

 The child was NOT wearing her hijab that day. She was wearing a hoodie. The hood was covering her eyes and the teacher asked her to pull the hood back, because school rules say you can’t have a hood over your head in class. Teacher never pulled anything. Not a hood , not a hijab, because the child did it. When the teacher saw she wasn’t wearing her hijab she said “oh oh put the hood up”

I don’t know where all this drama is coming from. 

"Harris (teacher's lawyer) said that Herman knows Muhammad and reached out to her."

"She and Ms. Muhammad are acquainted, and Ms. Herman has asked her to take down the original, erroneous post and post a clarification in its place," Harris said. "That has not happened yet."

https://patch.com/new-jersey/maplewood/maplewood-teachers-attorney-teacher-did-not-remove-hijab

eta - Even a past and the current Executive Directors of the CCR joined in the lynching of Ms. Herman on Muhammad's Facebook page, without waiting for an investigation or even waiting to hear Ms. Herman's side of the story. Extremely disappointing. 

What exactly are they teaching in Maplewood High School that is causing all this drama?  I don't know, the teaching may have changed somewhat from my days in High School, but we never had teachers banging their students like we did five years ago so they would do better in math class, and now this?  Let's all remember due process people, "innocent until proven guilty", but for goodness sake, just keep your hands off the students!  We have enough screwed up parenting going on around town to traumatize kids forever, we don't need the schools doing more of the same.

Also, have any of you noticed these troubling incidents only seem to happen in affluent, high tax, politically liberal, mostly white populations?  Of course, it's no surprise.  Mostly white and high taxes go together like birds of a feather.  I'm no psychologist, but I think much of this has to do with stress and pressure put on both the students and their educators with dumb cut and paste policies that create confusion and anxiety instead of promoting inclusion.

Lower taxes and integrate your communities better and these issues go away.  I firmly believe that.  Someone interested in being the next civil rights leader should look into this and work to ease the stress in these confused and embattled communities.

ConcernedHighTaxPayer said:

What exactly are they teaching in Maplewood High School that is causing all this drama?  I don't know, the teaching may have changed somewhat from my days in High School, but...

Maybe they teach better reading comprehension. This is about an event in an elementary school. 

And the high school would be a few blocks from your house (the one that has the cameras pointing at Memorial Park), so it's strange that you don't know it's not called "Maplewood High School".

ConcernedHighTaxPayer said:

I don't know, the teaching may have changed somewhat from my days in High School …

I lose the bet.

sprout said:

Maybe they teach better reading comprehension. This is about an event in an elementary school. 

And the high school would be a few blocks from your house (the one that has the cameras pointing at Memorial Park), so it's strange that you don't know it's not called "Maplewood High School".

 Oh, so it's the elementary school. Well that makes things worse. The national news said, "Maplewood School" not elementary school. Wow, okay. Good luck with that. I see on the heading on this post, it is Seth Boyden. Wow, that's sad. But still, let's not jump to conclusions (let's wait for all the facts to come out - due process) everything else applies though. Affluent community, mostly white, high taxes, liberal politics, and dumb cut and paste policies.

ConcernedHighTaxPayer said:

everything else applies though. Affluent community, mostly white, 

No -- Seth Boyden Elementary students are not affluent: There are over 200 students eligible for Free/reduced priced lunch (out of the 493 enrolled), 

And the school is not mostly white: There are only 114 white students (out of the 493 enrolled). 

https://nces.ed.gov/ccd/schoolsearch/school_detail.asp?Search=1&DistrictID=3415330&ID=341533002440

Why do you enjoy talking so much about topics you are not familiar with, when you have nothing constructive to contribute?

Jaytee said:

Tall_Mocha said:

 She did more than tell. But let’s say we go with that theory. Who pulled the hijab down to expose her hair which allegedly prompted the teacher to rescind her request?

 The child was NOT wearing her hijab that day. She was wearing a hoodie. The hood was covering her eyes and the teacher asked her to pull the hood back, because school rules say you can’t have a hood over your head in class. Teacher never pulled anything. Not a hood , not a hijab, because the child did it. When the teacher saw she wasn’t wearing her hijab she said “oh oh put the hood up”

I don’t know where all this drama is coming from. 

 You were there?

yahooyahoo said:

 You were there?

 No, but I read and understand the English language pretty well. This is from the teacher’s lawyer in the media. Ask him if he was there when you talk to him.

Ms. Herman did not, as has been alleged, forcibly remove a student’s hijab or tell a student that she should not have to wear a hijab. In accordance with school policy, Ms. Herman directed a student in her class to pull down the hood on a hooded sweatshirt because it was blocking her eyes – and immediately rescinded that request when she realized that the student was wearing the hood in place of, rather than on top of, her usual hijab. The

Jaytee said:

This is from the teacher’s lawyer in the media. Ask him if he was there when you talk to him.

In English, the lawyer’s name is Samantha.

Yes, I’m always this boring.

DaveSchmidt said:

In English, the lawyer’s name is Samantha.

Yes, I’m always this boring.

 Thank you for letting me know. I didn’t know the lawyer’s name. Did you manage to get the last name?

No, The Village Green did.

Isn't it Harris?

Samanatha Harris is licensed in Pa., but not in NJ.  Ms. Herman has also retained Ronald Ricci, who is licensed in NJ. 

https://www.allenharrislaw.com/samantha-harris-esq/

https://www.riccifavalaw.com/ronald-j-ricci/

Seems like the child was too young to say the hoodie was her hijab, which would have prevented a lot of ensuing miscommunication.  The teacher would need x-ray vision to know what was on or not on under the hoodie. Additionally, the child could have been wearing a hoodie rather than a hijab because she encountered bullying about wearing a hijab.  I don't think there should be any dress codes at this level of dress.  

sprout said:

No -- Seth Boyden Elementary students are not affluent: There are over 200 students eligible for Free/reduced priced lunch (out of the 493 enrolled), 

And the school is not mostly white: There are only 114 white students (out of the 493 enrolled). 

https://nces.ed.gov/ccd/schoolsearch/school_detail.asp?Search=1&DistrictID=3415330&ID=341533002440

Why do you enjoy talking so much about topics you are not familiar with, when you have nothing constructive to contribute?

 The school may not be mostly white, but the community is mostly white.  I was referring specifically to communities in the sense of the Town as a whole.  My constructive contribution here is that most places that have school incidents of violence and discrimination have two main components.  The first is a high tax neighborhood, community, state, county, etc... Examples abound Newton, Connecticut, Columbine, Colorado, Blacksburg, Virginia, the list goes on and on.  The second is the mostly white component.  Now, if you look at the statistics alone this is pretty obvious.  You may have a state with mostly white population, for example, but when you get into those areas that show a higher level of whites with higher level of taxes (hint:  gated communities that do not want minorities in their neighborhoods) you will find the school district discrimination and violence.  It's almost predictable at this point.  All I am saying is there should be a serious study done and communities should watch out for these sharp demographic shifts and the behaviors of the school districts.  There is no secret that the price of your home is directly linked to the "status" of your school (whiter schools, duh). With a greater exclusivity comes a greater need for wealth which causes a natural disparity in incomes and separation of upper and lower classes (minorities).  There are several problems that grow from this, including poverty, homelessness, stigmatization of certain people, and it is all out in the open and for the most part just ignored.  Everyone is in on the take.  From those who collect the taxes, to those who control the number of minority students who enter the school districts, to realtors who make more money by selling homes in more affluent neighborhoods with "better schools". That means whiter schools.  What's going to follow that?  I'm not saying this incident is what follows that, but it could be.  We have to wait for all the details to emerge.  I'm sure it was a big misunderstanding though.  I truly do not believe this would happen in Maplewood, but it could and we should watch for the critical (statistically proven) numbers to try and prevent such incidents.

I could detail various systemic root mechanisms that perpetuate "better/whiter schools" perceptions, and how some of those systems could be broken, but that's a very separate topic from "this incident". And I'm tired. So, some other time.