NJ Governor's Race

Jamie

I can't believe it's only a few weeks away and I haven't seen much discussion about it.

Seems like Murphy has a decent lead.

http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2017/09/upcoming_gubernatorial_election_is_going_to_be_a_b.html


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Gary

What race? There is no race. None at all.


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marylago


Burner said:

What race? There is no race. None at all.

CWA says they are expecting a close race.


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Gary

They are probably just worried that no one is going to vote. But that is just hype, There is no race.


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michaelgoldberg

I'm no fan of Christie or Guadagno, but can anyone explain how or why anyone would vote for Phil Murphy either?  The guy seems like nothing more than an extreme tax and spend politician who will make Florio and Corzine look good.  And for the icing on the cake, he chose a running-mate who supports BDS. (http://www.nj.com/opinion/index.ssf/2017/10/phil_murphy_shows_a_corzine-like_lack_of_sensitivi.html#incart_river_home

What a dreadful choice.


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Gary

No one opposes BDS more than me but I would not not crucify Oliver for that vote. It not like she voted in favor of BDS. And while I disagree with the ACLU's position on BDS, I can understand where they are coming from and expect (though I can not find anything directly) it was that which led to Oliver's vote.

But I do not have high expectations for Murphy. He will win easily though,


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mfpark

Likewise, I am having a hard time getting excited about Murphy as governor.  It is sad that he was able to buy the primary--one more example of party machine corruption in New Jersey.  All the other candidates were so much more specific on their proposals and excited to get a chance to run the state.  Murphy seems like he is satisfied with bland statements without specifics.  His only real platform is "vote for me because I say I am liberal and I made a ton of money on Wall Street."


I don't particularly mind a tax and spend liberal so long as the taxing is progressive and the spending is done in a really smart way to increase middle class jobs and quality of life, and is paired up with using a scalpel to get rid of the abusive spending that is in the current budget.  But absolutely nothing in what Murphy says shows any comprehension of doing things differently or better, and he does not show any of the radical toughness that will be required to take on Trenton.  All I see with Murphy is another go-along and get-along back-slapper who is going to get railroaded by Sweeney, Norcross, and the Union County cabal.


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Klinker


michaelgoldberg said:

I'm no fan of Christie or Guadagno, but can anyone explain how or why anyone would vote for Phil Murphy either?  The guy seems like nothing more than an extreme tax and spend politician who will make Florio and Corzine look good.  And for the icing on the cake, he chose a running-mate who supports BDS. (http://www.nj.com/opinion/index.ssf/2017/10/phil_murphy_shows_a_corzine-like_lack_of_sensitivi.html#incart_river_home

What a dreadful choice.

I am enthusiastic about his plan to legalize marijuana.  I have never fancied the idea of my kids spending a couple of years in prison because they gave it a try.


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LOST

There is no guaranty that Murphy will win, but if the Republican wins Trump will taut it as a great victory for him.


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yahooyahoo

Murphy paid a lot of money to get the job.  He will make sure it doesn't go to waste.

Guano is a joke, she has no chance.


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Runner Guy

I have a lot of disdain for Murphy and am bewildered by the Democrats choosing him.

The Democrats had a choice between several candidates who were lifelong fighters for progressivism and Phil Murphy, who spent his life making a fortune at Goldman Sachs.  

Goldman Sachs won.

And worse, Murphy has spent almost none of his adult life in NJ.  He moved here in 2000 at age 43.  He spent four of his years nominally a NJ resident in Berlin anyway.  His kids go to Phillips Andover and his wife is a trustee of UVA, not Rutgers. 

And Murphy's hypocrisy sickens me.  Murphy lives in a 10,000 sq ft house, and he talks about environmental responsibility? He flies in a Gulfstream jet and talks about mitigating climate change? Goldman Sachs has taken billions in corporate welfare from NJ, NY, UT, and TX and Murphy attacks Christie for "putting corporations ahead of school children"?  



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Klinker


Runner_Guy said:

I have a lot of disdain for Murphy and am bewildered by the Democrats choosing him.

The Democrats had a choice between several candidates who were lifelong fighters for progressivism and Phil Murphy, who spent his life making a fortune at Goldman Sachs.  

Goldman Sachs won.

And worse, Murphy has spent almost none of his adult life in NJ.  He moved here in 2000 at age 43.  He spent four of his years nominally a NJ resident in Berlin anyway.  His kids go to Phillips Andover and his wife is a trustee of UVA, not Rutgers. 

And Murphy's hypocrisy sickens me.  Murphy lives in a 10,000 sq ft house, and he talks about environmental responsibility? He flies in a Gulfstream jet and talks about mitigating climate change? Goldman Sachs has taken billions in corporate welfare from NJ, NY, UT, and TX and Murphy attacks Christie for "putting corporations ahead of school children"?  

I feel much the same but I am still voting.  Just think about how much damage Christie did when he canceled the tunnel.

That said, we definitely need to reform the nomination process and reduce the power of the county committees.  No one ought to be able to buy the top line on the ballot.



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Gary

I am still angry at the ego of the other candidates that prevented them from uniting behind a single alternative to Murphy. 


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ml1

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 


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cubby

nj.com (3 days ago):

TRENTON -- With Election Day just five weeks away, a new poll shows Democratic nominee Phil Murphy leading Republican Kim Guadagno by 14 percentage points in the race to succeed Gov. Chris Christie -- a tighter margin than those in recent similar surveys.

The Monmouth University Poll released Tuesday shows 51 percent of likely New Jersey voters back Murphy, a former U.S. ambassador to Germany and ex-Goldman Sachs banking executive. Meanwhile, 37 support Guadagno, Christie's lieutenant governor.


10/16/16:

Hillary Clinton is on the cusp of a commanding presidential election victory over Donald Trump if the latest poll - 51-37 in the Democrat's favour - is to be believed.

The Associated Press-GfK poll gives the Democrat her largest lead yet with just 12 days until the election.



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FilmCarp

I will vote for Murphy, but without any enthusiasm.  I hope he is the last product of the machine that Trump beat.  We need a new Democratic party.


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BG9


cubby said:

nj.com (3 days ago):

TRENTON -- With Election Day just five weeks away, a new poll shows Democratic nominee Phil Murphy leading Republican Kim Guadagno by 14 percentage points in the race to succeed Gov. Chris Christie -- a tighter margin than those in recent similar surveys.

The Monmouth University Poll released Tuesday shows 51 percent of likely New Jersey voters back Murphy, a former U.S. ambassador to Germany and ex-Goldman Sachs banking executive. Meanwhile, 37 support Guadagno, Christie's lieutenant governor.

Coincidentally or maybe not so, 37 percent just happens to be the deplorable base support for Trump.

http://news.gallup.com/poll/201617/gallup-daily-trump-job-approval.aspx


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yahooyahoo

Corzine and McGreevey both sucked.  I can't even remember if Codey accomplished anything.

Be careful what you wish for.

ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 



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Red Barchetta


ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 

Murphy knows that and is acting accordingly.



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ml1

In a perfect world I'd get what I wish for. In the world we really live in, I have to choose between plausible alternatives 

yahooyahoo said:

Corzine and McGreevey both sucked.  I can't even remember if Codey accomplished anything.

Be careful what you wish for.
ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 



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Runner Guy


ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 

I'd compartmentalize NJ's governors and rank them the worst in different categories.

1.  Most egotistical? Most disrespectful?  Christie. 

2.  Most fiscally irresponsible?  Whitman.

3.  Most venal?  DiFrancesco. 

4.  Most arrogant?  Most dishonest?  Florio.  ("dishonest" = difference between what he campaigned on and what he actually did.)

Christie looks really bad right now, but he has governed in the worst fiscal environment of any New Jersey governor.  Christie took office during the Great Recession, presided over the Atlantic City implosion, and governed at a point when we could not ignore the Pension Crisis and had to put all of NJ's new revenue into pensions, healthcare, and other debt.  Christie also governed in an era when NJ's economy grew very slowly. (which I don't see as his fault)

Christie actually put more into the pension system than all the governors from Whitman-Corzine (combined and adjusted for inflation)

The governors before Christie took NJ's new revenue (which was stronger before 2001 anyway) and spent it. 

When you have lots more money to spend every year, it's easy to be popular.


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Runner Guy


Klinker said:



Runner_Guy said:

I have a lot of disdain for Murphy and am bewildered by the Democrats choosing him.

The Democrats had a choice between several candidates who were lifelong fighters for progressivism and Phil Murphy, who spent his life making a fortune at Goldman Sachs.  

Goldman Sachs won.

And worse, Murphy has spent almost none of his adult life in NJ.  He moved here in 2000 at age 43.  He spent four of his years nominally a NJ resident in Berlin anyway.  His kids go to Phillips Andover and his wife is a trustee of UVA, not Rutgers. 

And Murphy's hypocrisy sickens me.  Murphy lives in a 10,000 sq ft house, and he talks about environmental responsibility? He flies in a Gulfstream jet and talks about mitigating climate change? Goldman Sachs has taken billions in corporate welfare from NJ, NY, UT, and TX and Murphy attacks Christie for "putting corporations ahead of school children"?  

I feel much the same but I am still voting.  Just think about how much damage Christie did when he canceled the tunnel.

That said, we definitely need to reform the nomination process and reduce the power of the county committees.  No one ought to be able to buy the top line on the ballot.

The thing with the ARC is that New Jersey was going to be responsible for all of the cost overruns and the cost overruns would have been in the billions (as big public construction projects always are, like the Oculus.)

Andrew Cuomo of New York deserves a ton of blame for the ARC cancellation because he refused to pay for a cent of that tunnel, even though NYS would be, arguably, a bigger beneficiary than New Jersey since those NJ commuters pay income taxes to New York, not New Jersey.  

As late as 2015 Cuomo was saying "that's not my tunnel" and refusing to pay for an infrastructure project that was going to be in his own state.


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John


Runner_Guy said:



ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 

I'd compartmentalize NJ's governors and rank them the worst in different categories.

1.  Most egotistical? Most disrespectful?  Christie. 

2.  Most fiscally irresponsible?  Whitman.

3.  Most venal?  DiFrancesco. 

4.  Most arrogant?  Most dishonest?  Florio.  ("dishonest" = difference between what he campaigned on and what he actually did.)

Christie looks really bad right now, but he has governed in the worst fiscal environment of any New Jersey governor.  Christie took office during the Great Recession, presided over the Atlantic City implosion, and governed at a point when we could not ignore the Pension Crisis and had to put all of NJ's new revenue into pensions, healthcare, and other debt.  Christie also governed in an era when NJ's economy grew very slowly. (which I don't see as his fault)

Christie actually put more into the pension system than all the governors from Whitman-Corzine (combined and adjusted for inflation)

The governors before Christie took NJ's new revenue (which was stronger before 2001 anyway) and spent it. 

When you have lots more money to spend every year, it's easy to be popular.

Then we can also look at the Revel Casino bailout. We will be paying for that for a while. What about the cock-up with the money lost to the educational grant, "Race to the Top." After screwing it up, he blames it on his Secretary of Education (forgot his name). 

Yes, he put $$ into the pension fund but after promising $$$, he contributed $-$ and skipped a couple of years. 

Then, we have the tax proposal which was to lower taxes estate taxes for the richest among us.

On a smaller scale, helicopter rides at several thousand $ per ride.  




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Runner Guy


Formerlyjerseyjack said:



Runner_Guy said:



ml1 said:

After 8 years of Christie I can't believe anyone can be that upset about anything regarding Phil Murphy. We have nowhere to go but up. Christie has been by miles and miles and miles the worst governor of my lifetime. I will gladly vote for literally anyone on the Democratic line. Without any hesitation whatsoever. 

I'd compartmentalize NJ's governors and rank them the worst in different categories.

1.  Most egotistical? Most disrespectful?  Christie. 

2.  Most fiscally irresponsible?  Whitman.

3.  Most venal?  DiFrancesco. 

4.  Most arrogant?  Most dishonest?  Florio.  ("dishonest" = difference between what he campaigned on and what he actually did.)

Christie looks really bad right now, but he has governed in the worst fiscal environment of any New Jersey governor.  Christie took office during the Great Recession, presided over the Atlantic City implosion, and governed at a point when we could not ignore the Pension Crisis and had to put all of NJ's new revenue into pensions, healthcare, and other debt.  Christie also governed in an era when NJ's economy grew very slowly. (which I don't see as his fault)

Christie actually put more into the pension system than all the governors from Whitman-Corzine (combined and adjusted for inflation)

The governors before Christie took NJ's new revenue (which was stronger before 2001 anyway) and spent it. 

When you have lots more money to spend every year, it's easy to be popular.

Then we can also look at the Revel Casino bailout. We will be paying for that for a while. What about the cock-up with the money lost to the educational grant, "Race to the Top." After screwing it up, he blames it on his Secretary of Education (forgot his name). 

Yes, he put $$ into the pension fund but after promising $$$, he contributed $-$ and skipped a couple of years. 

Then, we have the tax proposal which was to lower taxes estate taxes for the richest among us.

On a smaller scale, helicopter rides at several thousand $ per ride.  

re: Revel

This isn't how tax incentives work.  NJ's tax incentives are a give-back of the income taxes paid by the workers of the company.  The amount you hear about in headline news is just the maximum payout, if all investment benchmarks are met. 

If a company doesn't meet the investment benchmarks, it gets less than headline approval.  If a company folds altogether, like the Revel, it gets nothing after the business closes.

NJ's Treasury didn't lose very much on the Revel deal, since the Revel closed so soon after opening.  The people who lost money on the Revel were the casino's investors.  

Re: pension funds

NJ's full Actuarially Recommended Contribution is $5 billion for FY2018 and almost as high for previous years.  

Please sketch out a tax increase plan or plan for budget cuts that would allow NJ to reach that payment before you criticize Christie for not making the whole payment.    

Without Chapter 78 (which  I, as a public sector worker strongly support), NJ's budget crisis would be even deeper. 

Phil Murphy has already backtracked on pension funding.  He is now saying that he is going to stick to the ten year rampup to full funding that Christie had NJ on. 


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Klinker


Runner_Guy said:



Klinker said:



Runner_Guy said:

I have a lot of disdain for Murphy and am bewildered by the Democrats choosing him.

The Democrats had a choice between several candidates who were lifelong fighters for progressivism and Phil Murphy, who spent his life making a fortune at Goldman Sachs.  

Goldman Sachs won.

And worse, Murphy has spent almost none of his adult life in NJ.  He moved here in 2000 at age 43.  He spent four of his years nominally a NJ resident in Berlin anyway.  His kids go to Phillips Andover and his wife is a trustee of UVA, not Rutgers. 

And Murphy's hypocrisy sickens me.  Murphy lives in a 10,000 sq ft house, and he talks about environmental responsibility? He flies in a Gulfstream jet and talks about mitigating climate change? Goldman Sachs has taken billions in corporate welfare from NJ, NY, UT, and TX and Murphy attacks Christie for "putting corporations ahead of school children"?  

I feel much the same but I am still voting.  Just think about how much damage Christie did when he canceled the tunnel.

That said, we definitely need to reform the nomination process and reduce the power of the county committees.  No one ought to be able to buy the top line on the ballot.

The thing with the ARC is that New Jersey was going to be responsible for all of the cost overruns and the cost overruns would have been in the billions (as big public construction projects always are, like the Oculus.)

Andrew Cuomo of New York deserves a ton of blame for the ARC cancellation because he refused to pay for a cent of that tunnel, even though NYS would be, arguably, a bigger beneficiary than New Jersey since those NJ commuters pay income taxes to New York, not New Jersey.  

As late as 2015 Cuomo was saying "that's not my tunnel" and refusing to pay for an infrastructure project that was going to be in his own state.

Speaking as someone who's livelihood depends on easy access to the city, sometimes you just have to do what you have to do.  Billions of dollars in cost overruns pale in comparison to the damage that we will suffer if Sandy II takes the tunnels out permanently next week.

That said, even if your argument was valid, he could have taken the money saved and plowed it into propping up our crumbling transit system in other ways.  Instead, he has spent the last 8 years gutting NJ Transit  cutting state funding by almost 90%.

I suspect there might be at least one good thing that Christie did somewhere in this state in the last 8 years but his transit policy sure as hell isn't it. Does he recycle?  That might be a good place to look.


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BG9

I often hear "lets not build because of cost overruns." The assumption is there'll be a cost overrun and then to bring up some project that did have an overrun to prove the point. Its an assumption. Also, the "Whataboutism" of cost overruns. So, let us not build anything.

However, there are large multi-year projects that do not have cost overruns which are conveniently not brought up.

As Klinker said, some projects are necessary. The tunnel is reaching the end of its life besides the fact it cannot handle the heavier commuting traffic needs. We need serious remediation; a new tunnel and rebuild of the present tunnel. We can either build up and expand or not build and thereby escalate ourselves into 2nd or 3rd world status.

What happens if terrorists blow up the GW bridge? Will we not rebuild due to possible cost overruns?

The possible cost overrun argument to prevent a project is the silly,, stupid and short sighted.


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kibbegirl

Where have all the good candidates gone? Are they deliberately hiding them from us or can they not afford to run because they don't want their souls hocked for favors? From local to governor to president, we're being fed mediocre. This thread unfortunately reads a lot like the presidential race: no one is truly happy but voting anyway and making the best of it. So disheartening.


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John

Alls I know is that Christie instituted a freeze on cost of living adjustments to retirees. In exchange, he was going to make contributions to the fund in amounts that would stabilize it.

I am a retiree. While I was unhappy about not receiving a C.O.L.A., at least, the bulk of our pensions was going to be secured by the promised contributions. 

---then Christie defaulted on that promise.  I feel ....ed both ways.

Runner_Guy said:



....

Please sketch out a tax increase plan or plan for budget cuts that would allow NJ to reach that payment before you criticize Christie for not making the whole payment.    
.... 

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Klinker


BG9 said:

What happens if terrorists blow up the GW bridge? Will we not rebuild due to possible cost overruns?

This!  Of course, we have already seen what happens when terrorists (or, perhaps, one pudgy terrorist in a beach chair) shut the GWB down for a couple of days.


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