Newark is an Amazon Finalist
I would love it to be Newark but EWR alone is enough to drive companies away. Would you fly through EWR is you had a choice?
shoshannah said:
annettedepalma said:
Shoshannah, I was thinking along the same lines: a public/private partnership upgrading transportation in a a major northeast hub might be enticing to a retail/finance guy in Bezos' position. I don't have a problem with incentivizing an industry whose presence would so positively, directly and indirectly, impact a relatively struggling community. Newark is an important city. It deserves much more than it's gotten in the last 50 years (notwithstanding some important development in the last decade or so).
And Bezos likes a challenge. He bought the Washington Post and did a GREAT job with it, despite the initial skepticism. He turned a declining print newspaper into a digital powerhouse that is earning a profit. AND he stays out of the editorial side. If he can see Penn Station and the trains as media property, he can do well with it. Streaming WaPo news across in ticker inside the trains. Ads. Free Amazon music inside the trains.
Get Bezos on the horn for me!
What? Where did you get this information--The Washington Post? He stays out of the editorial side????? You believe that? No, the writers are not allowed to write negative things about any of the advertisers. He has a huge contract with the CIA and the paper is basically a mouthpiece for the CIA. He's the richest guy in the world and he is not on our side.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/amazon-jobs_us_583db239e4b06539a78a7992
I got it from Marty Baron himself. He can work for any major newspaper in the world. Wherever he wants. If he felt there were interference, he wouldn't stay at WaPo.
On Jeff Bezos’ level of involvement in the Washington Post
Befitting a dinner celebrating business journalism, the conversation eventually moved off Trump and shifted to Post ownerBezos. The Amazon founder—and occasional Trump punching bag—bought the paper in 2013 for $250 million.
“He does get involved, heavily involved, in the tactics and strategy of the Post,” Baron said, particularly in terms of the paper’s technology capabilities, metrics, and its revampedsubscription model. “The intellectual capital [from Bezos] is at least as important as the financial capital. … We talk to him about once every two weeks on a conference call. Occasionally he’s in Washington and comes by to visits us.”
But the billionaire owner has had no input on coverage and hasn’t attempted to provide any. “Maybe Trump would if he were the owner of the Washington Post,” Baron said, but under Bezos the paper enjoys what the editor described as “complete independence.”
I think that there are more educated and intelligent people there than many people realize. I am thinking right now of two highly educated and motivated friends who live in Newark and could handle challenging positions. I also strongly believe that for many years people in corporate jobs have learned on the job, and some are good while others are not. Ask yourself honestly when you look at your office mates if they are all perfect when they get the job.
Red_Barchetta said:
FilmCarp said:
I'm not saying that's why they will pick Newark. I'm saying we should impress upon them our hope that locals will get real jobs there, not just cleaning up or serving food to privileged folks.
I have no data to support this, but I’m skeptical that there are many Newarkers who meet the criteria for these new jobs (advertised as paying $100k) that are currently un or under employed.
Compared to most other airports? Yes. I think EWR is pretty good. Just in this area alone, far better than JFK or LGA
Klinker said:
I would love it to be Newark but EWR alone is enough to drive companies away. Would you fly through EWR is you had a choice?
Would love to hear Marty Baron's thoughts on this:
Multiple articles about Bezoes and his relationship with the CIA affecting the Washington Post:
CIA-Funded Washington Post Smears Indie Media For Covering DNC Fraud Lawsuit
CIA-Funded Washington Post Doesn’t Think You Should Pay Attention To The CIA Leaks
https://www.newslogue.com/debate/384/CaitlinJohnstone
Jeff Bezos is Using The Washington Post to Protect the CIA
https://trofire.com/2017/03/19/jeff-bezos-using-washington-post-protect-cia/
Jeff Bezos Is Doing Huge Business with the CIA, While Keeping His Washington Post Readers in the Dark
conandrob240 said:
Compared to most other airports? Yes. I think EWR is pretty good. Just in this area alone, far better than JFK or LGA
Klinker said:
I would love it to be Newark but EWR alone is enough to drive companies away. Would you fly through EWR is you had a choice?
Not the most enjoyable ambiance for sure, but you can get just about anywhere from EWR with the same or fewer connections than from most anywhere else and that is a big plus. (Yes, I really do love the airports in those mid-sized cities, but getting from them to other places is not as easy, on average, as from the major hubs like EWR.)
I'm not disputing that they are out there. What I'm saying is that if they are qualified for these new-to-be-created positions, they are using their intelligence and education in furtherance of some other career. If they've got the stuff for Amazon, they are not likely pouring coffee right now.
FilmCarp said:
I think that there are more educated and intelligent people there than many people realize. I am thinking right now of two highly educated and motivated friends who live in Newark and could handle challenging positions. I also strongly believe that for many years people in corporate jobs have learned on the job, and some are good while others are not. Ask yourself honestly when you look at your office mates if they are all perfect when they get the job.
Red_Barchetta said:
FilmCarp said:
I'm not saying that's why they will pick Newark. I'm saying we should impress upon them our hope that locals will get real jobs there, not just cleaning up or serving food to privileged folks.
I have no data to support this, but I’m skeptical that there are many Newarkers who meet the criteria for these new jobs (advertised as paying $100k) that are currently un or under employed.
I flew in and out of EWR every week (and thus in and out of other airports every week). I find EWR to be superior most other airports. And yes, I do have a choice to fly out of EWR, LGA, and JFK. Once again, I find EWR to be superior, especially with what is going on with LGA right now - what a nightmare.
Klinker said:
I would love it to be Newark but EWR alone is enough to drive companies away. Would you fly through EWR is you had a choice?
+10. I think people who don’t fly too often see a bad flight out of EWR and it sticks with them. I’ll see their EWR and raise them an LGA or BOS.... especially for domestic under 2hrs.
lanky said:
I flew in and out of EWR every week (and thus in and out of other airports every week). I find EWR to be superior most other airports. And yes, I do have a choice to fly out of EWR, LGA, and JFK. Once again, I find EWR to be superior, especially with what is going on with LGA right now - what a nightmare.
Klinker said:
I would love it to be Newark but EWR alone is enough to drive companies away. Would you fly through EWR is you had a choice?
Is there anyone else who is a little annoyed at Jon Whiten's of the NJPP's constant criticism of providing tax breaks to Amazon?
The New Jersey Policy Perspective is like "WARNING! New Jersey is at risk if getting 50,000 high paying jobs, billions in investment!" "ALERT! Newark may become a tech hub!"
----
PS I think EWR is a good airport too. It has tons of connections and dropoff and pickup are very easy.
I think what would happen is that talented & employed people in the Newark area will get a portion of the Google jobs and then their old jobs will be backfilled by other talented people in the Newark area that may or may not be employed. Google's arrival would have a cascade effect through the local talent pool.
FilmCarp said:
I think that there are more educated and intelligent people there than many people realize. I am thinking right now of two highly educated and motivated friends who live in Newark and could handle challenging positions. I also strongly believe that for many years people in corporate jobs have learned on the job, and some are good while others are not. Ask yourself honestly when you look at your office mates if they are all perfect when they get the job.
Red_Barchetta said:
FilmCarp said:
I'm not saying that's why they will pick Newark. I'm saying we should impress upon them our hope that locals will get real jobs there, not just cleaning up or serving food to privileged folks.
I have no data to support this, but I’m skeptical that there are many Newarkers who meet the criteria for these new jobs (advertised as paying $100k) that are currently un or under employed.
Boston leading the race with 3/1 odds. Austin and Atlanta up next at 7/2.
If Boston gets Amazon I hope people don't start shouting "taxes don't matter" because (even before incentives are factored in) Boston and Massachusetts have average taxes, not high taxes.
And there is no other place in the United States that has that constellation of universities anyway.
DannyArcher said:
Boston leading the race with 3/1 odds. Austin and Atlanta up next at 7/2.
I doubt anyone will be shouting. But if Boston gets Amazon it will be an indication that tax rates weren't especially critical to the decision. Some of the other finalists are located in very low tax states.
True, but if being close to MIT and Harvard is so important, why didn't Amazon just begin in Boston as a start-up?
NYC/Newark offers access to Princeton (which Bezos and some other top Amazon folks attended), Columbia, NYU, Rutgers, NJIT and Cornell Tech, which is emerging as an innovative place with deep partnerships with industry. Not a shabby list. The problem is it will be difficult for all of those institutions to unify and be part of a proposal, as some may favor NYC over Newark or vice-versa. Princeton U's letter to Amazon pitching the area emphasized New Jersey, and not so much Newark.
Every city on the list ticks off a lot of boxes. Have to wonder how much of the decision will just be emotional - the decision-makers asking themselves, "Whichever city we pick, I'm going to be spending a lot of my time and life there. Do I want that to be Newark? Or do I want that to be Austin?" Then again, they're wealthy enough that they can travel and have homes pretty much wherever they want.
Runner_Guy said:
And there is no other place in the United States that has that constellation of universities anyway.
Boston’s proposal didn’t include any specifics on tax breaks. I think once that discussion happens we can start talking about who is a front-runner. Plus Boston proposed a site that I can’t imagine Amazon wants. They currently have two offices in MA - 500k sf in Kendall square and the seaport (and they’re currently shopping for another 500k sf in the seaport outside of HQ2). Both are nerdy business hub type neighborhoods. The proposed HQ2 site is an abandoned horse track behind a tank farm.
I guess what I’m trying to say is...I still think they’ll land in Austin or Atlanta.
He wanted to be close to Microsoft and some big book distributors in Oregon.
apple44 said:
True, but if being close to MIT and Harvard is so important, why didn't Amazon just begin in Boston as a start-up?
RobB said:
He wanted to be close to Microsoft and some big book distributors in Oregon.
apple44 said:
True, but if being close to MIT and Harvard is so important, why didn't Amazon just begin in Boston as a start-up?
As I understand it, the presence of Microsoft meant that there was a real "critical mass" of programmers, which drove his decision on where to locate originally. Similarly, while universities can contribute to having a "critical mass" of tech workers in an area, I think our area has as much or greater amount of talent for Amazon to tap right away. After that, Amazon itself will be the draw, to maintain that "critical mass".
FilmCarp said:
Tom_Reingold said:
I'm a tech worker, and I live two blocks from the Christopher St PATH station, so this is good news for me. I could hang with my NJ peeps.
Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't want you getting the job. I want Newark folks to get the jobs. I know plenty of intelligent, driven, educated people in Newark who need those jobs more than someone who already has one.
I won't take it the wrong way.
First, it makes sense to want minorities to be lifted faster than white men.
Second, it makes sense to want people like a typical Newarker to get a job over someone like me.
But specifically, I don't currently have a job and am searching. I'm all for trends which make improvements for the population, but I also have to take care of myself. I hope I get a job soon, and I hope you have the same hope for me. I also hope that the fortune of large populations is improved. I do realize that these are somewhat in conflict, but I can't apologize for that.
I read Boston's proposal and I interpreted their stance on incentives as "we will talk about them later."
Boston and Massachusetts offered $145 million to GE, so I would be surprised if they didn't offer anything to Amazon when all of their competitors (except Toronto) are offering incentives.
RobB said:
Boston’s proposal didn’t include any specifics on tax breaks. I think once that discussion happens we can start talking about who is a front-runner. Plus Boston proposed a site that I can’t imagine Amazon wants. They currently have two offices in MA - 500k sf in Kendall square and the seaport (and they’re currently shopping for another 500k sf in the seaport outside of HQ2). Both are nerdy business hub type neighborhoods. The proposed HQ2 site is an abandoned horse track behind a tank farm.
I guess what I’m trying to say is...I still think they’ll land in Austin or Atlanta.
Runner_Guy said:
I read Boston's proposal and I interpreted their stance on incentives as "we will talk about them later."
I would think that "later" is "now", if the decision process is this far along.
FYI... Here's a plausible argument that Amazon will go to Northern Virginia.
Just a few years ago there was some coverage of the "bruising" work culture at Amazon. Interesting how the headquarters story seems to have totally eclipsed that. Seems that, for many job seekers, Amazon simply is not going to be the best fit.
"At Amazon, workers are encouraged to tear apart one another’s ideas in meetings, toil long and late (emails arrive past midnight, followed by text messages asking why they were not answered), and held to standards that the company boasts are 'unreasonably high.' The internal phone directory instructs colleagues on how to send secret feedback to one another’s bosses. Employees say it is frequently used to sabotage others. (The tool offers sample texts, including this: "I felt concerned about his inflexibility and openly complaining about minor tasks.') ...
[One manager} said that his enduring image was watching people weep in the office, a sight other workers described as well. 'You walk out of a conference room and you’ll see a grown man covering his face,' he said. 'Nearly every person I worked with, I saw cry at their desk'.”
- The New York Times, August 15, 2015
#MAGA
apple44 said:
Just a few years ago there was some coverage of the "bruising" work culture at Amazon. Interesting how the headquarters story seems to have totally eclipsed that. Seems that, for many job seekers, Amazon simply is not going to be the best fit.
"At Amazon, workers are encouraged to tear apart one another’s ideas in meetings, toil long and late (emails arrive past midnight, followed by text messages asking why they were not answered), and held to standards that the company boasts are 'unreasonably high.' The internal phone directory instructs colleagues on how to send secret feedback to one another’s bosses. Employees say it is frequently used to sabotage others. (The tool offers sample texts, including this: "I felt concerned about his inflexibility and openly complaining about minor tasks.') ...
[One manager} said that his enduring image was watching people weep in the office, a sight other workers described as well. 'You walk out of a conference room and you’ll see a grown man covering his face,' he said. 'Nearly every person I worked with, I saw cry at their desk'.”
- The New York Times, August 15, 2015
"But, there's one part of Amazon's HQ2 competition that is deeply disturbing -- pitting city against city in a wasteful and economically unproductive bidding war for tax and other incentives. As one of the world's most valuable companies, Amazon does not need -- and should not be going after -- taxpayer dollars that could be better used on schools, parks, transit, housing or other much needed public goods.
The company would add far more value to its brand by eschewing incentives and instead working with the winner to address challenges like affordable housing and traffic congestion, which its new headquarters is likely to exacerbate."
I agree with that in theory, but if they were to just make a decision on their own, some cities might argue, "Hey, why weren't we given a chance to present a proposal?" Also, one would hope that Amazon reinvests in the chosen city through philanthropy, and their moving to a city will lay the ground for public-private partnerships.
Affordable housing is a big concern in Seattle, and likely will be wherever HQ2 lands, because high-paying jobs push out people who don't have them. There will be benefits, but the scenario is complicated.
But whatever, shout out for Pittsburgh, my hometown.
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I have no data to support this, but I’m skeptical that there are many Newarkers who meet the criteria for these new jobs (advertised as paying $100k) that are currently un or under employed.