Emoluments, tax returns and debt

How will Trump get around it? Is he waiting to appoint the right people to help him circumvent this? Will the Republican majority make an exception?

There's probably a dozen articles a day trying to get to the bottom of this. Here's one I just ran across:

http://www.salon.com/2016/12/21/conflicts-on-top-of-conflicts-another-emoluments-clause-that-should-bar-donald-trump-from-office/

Who will prove that the clause has been violated:

http://blog.constitutioncenter.org/2016/12/constitution-check-can-a-violation-of-the-emoluments-clause-be-proven/

It prohibits any “Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under [the United States]” from accepting “any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.”

So if we break down emolument, (pronounced ee-MAHL-yoo-mint) is a gain, either in money or perks, from one’s employment, a wage or fee.

If a foreign diplomat stay at a Trump hotel - can this be seen as an emolument? Trump is benefiting either directly or indirectly from foreign money. How will we know what exactly Trump will benefit with his global assets - will the American public ever know? Will we ever see his tax returns? The repetition mantra from his surrogates lately has been that a majority of the American public do not care about his taxes.

I'm assuming he's going to do what he pleases and no one will stop him. His supporters certainly don't care. And the GOP Congress surely doesn't care. What's stopping him from continuing to do business in other countries or with other countries?

While one should never "assume" I think you are correct.

And the one time Trump plans to address the press in regards to his business issue - he claims to be too busy. But he has plenty of time for a "Thank you" Tour - here's the transcript from one:

http://wbay.com/2016/12/13/complete-text-of-donald-trumps-thank-you-tour-speech-in-wisconsin/

I think we need to be realistic. If this was an issue for the GOP they certainly could have raised it during the primaries when he first ran. Or they could have used it as a reason not to nominate him. Maybe if they decide he's an albatross around the party's neck, they would impeach him with this as the reason.

Some days I think if an opportunity to get rid of Trump via impeachment came up the GOP would take it. Or maybe at least enough Republicans to vote to impeach in the House and convict in the Senate. A lot would probably prefer President Pence.

You are engaging in wishful thinking.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/donald-trump-congress-republicans-232800

LOST said:

You are engaging in wishful thinking.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/donald-trump-congress-republicans-232800

It's what I have left.

How would Trump retaliate if there was an attack on Trump towers in Turkey? Would it be equivalent to an attack on our embassy? Would Trump assets need additional security?

Funny, worrying about a foreigner staying in a Trump property. I don't recall that sort of concern 6 weeks ago. At least they would be buying a night's stay rather than just cutting a check

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2016/jul/07/fact-checking-donations-clinton-foundation/

http://www.politifact.com/arizona/statements/2016/jul/11/donald-trump/did-hillary-clinton-take-money-countries-treat-wom/

The curbside lawyering meter's needle is buried. I welcome further efforts in this vein, as a guy who enjoys watching this sort of stuff, but candidly your efforts to undermine his presidency are better spent elsewhere.

The fact that foreigners might spend money at his DC hotel are small potatoes. The issue is more what will happen with his real estate investments around the world. How will his business interests influence his foreign policy?

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/26/us/politics/donald-trump-international-business.html?_r=0

Foreigners staying at the hotel is the tip of the iceberg in regards to this property. After election - Trump sued DC over the value of the building. U.S. General Services Administration says is worth $91 million - the Trumps say it is only worth $28 million. And he doesn't think that he has to pay 1.7 million in taxes. Now he'll be appointing the head of the General Services Administration. Not only that - the language in the contract is clear: "No ... elected official of the Government of the United States ... shall be admitted to any share or part of this Lease, or to any benefit that may arise therefrom..." So there's that - he'll be landlord and tenant.

I admire those who still cling to some kind of hope. Nothing surprises me anymore, and I expect only the worst.

I have a glimmer of hope: it might be too cumbersome or embarrassing for Congress to live with these conflicts of interest, and they might turn on him. We have no idea how likely this is, because circumstances will surely change.

As long as their agenda is being taken care of, they'll have no problem with the fraud in chief.

Tom, the fact that T-rump was the Republican delegate is proof Congress cannot be embarrassed.

I read that the day Trump becomes President he will be in violation of the lease for the Post Office building in D.C.

The GSA is now saying that's not necessarily true. Someone needs to step up and be the adult in this situation.

bump - again I feel this subject is getting buried in the current coverage. Or are Trump's tweets a distraction from this? He won't be able to avoid this at the next press conference. Seriously - how will this be addressed?

Next press conference? When will that be?

Will any reporter have the guts to bring it up? If so should we not expect evasion?

As long as the press keeps reporting the tweets, Trump controls the message. Why should he give a news conference? Why should he take questions? Only the press can change his behavior, by not reporting the tweets. They will not skip the clicks that the tweets provide, so don't expect any changes soon.

The press MUST report the tweets. Don't you want to know what he's telling his followers? Please understand that with every tweet, he is building a false reality, a false history for his followers.

Now,the press certainly needs to change the way they report about the tweets, but they can't ignore the major means of communication of the, gulp, Leader of the Free World.

max_weisenfeld said:

As long as the press keeps reporting the tweets, Trump controls the message. Why should he give a news conference? Why should he take questions? Only the press can change his behavior, by not reporting the tweets. They will not skip the clicks that the tweets provide, so don't expect any changes soon.

LOST said:

Next press conference? When will that be?

Next Wednesday - it will be a challenging news day as Maddow pointed out tonight - Trump is trying to push through a number of his nominations through on that day as well. It looked like ten, I can't find the list online - I found this list: http://www.politico.com/blogs/donald-trump-administration/2017/01/trumps-cabinet-hearings-schedule-233213

I am curious to see the Ben Carson hearing.

ok, so we did get an update in regards to conflicts of interest. Here's what we learned:

Trump states that by law - he can run his business and the country at the same time. But, he's going to let his sons run it and they won't discuss it with him.

Trump shows the separation from his business via a stack of folders containing blank papers.

Trump makes further sacrifices for America by not accepting a 2 billion dollar deal in the UAE.

Trump's lawyer educates the American public on the emoluments clause and shows that Trump will not be in violation of it.

Any money that is collected by Trump businesses from foreign diplomats (or foreigners?) will go directly to the US Treasury. Ummm, how will this be tracked?

And by pure coincidence: The law firm representing Trump during the news conference won Russia Law Firm of the Year award in 2016.

So - all good!

jamie said:

And by pure coincidence: The law firm representing Trump during the news conference won Russia Law Firm of the Year award in 2016.

So - all good!

So, ultimately, it all ends with Russia.

Finally, I'm beginning to see where Trump fits into Putin's restricted org chart. Trump will be in the oligarch box, one of many. Not even a direct report.

ok, I edited the title to include tax returns and debt. Katy Tur just asked Sean Spicer why Trump won't release a list of who he's in debt to/release his taxes. Spicer says that Q has been asked and answered.

Are any Trump supporter out there ok with this?

jamie said:

ok, I edited the title to include tax returns and debt. Katy Tur just asked Sean Spicer why Trump won't release a list of who he's in debt to/release his taxes. Spicer says that Q has been asked and answered.

Are any Trump supporter out there ok with this?

"Asked and answered" was his way of saying, "What part of 'f*ck off' didn't you understand?"

There has to be openness and disclosure, and you would think they'd remember the lesson of, "It's not the crime, it's the cover-up."

Though I don't believe any audit exists, I'd argue that the national interest in knowing the president's financial ties exceeds any incremental tax that might be collected pursuant to an audit. I'd ask President Trump to use his authority to end the audit if it results in a full release of his records.

How long does an audit take? Are we even sure he is being audited?

Trump has never produced any audit letter from the IRS or any verifiable evidence of an audit. His lawyer states that his taxes for the years 2009 through 2015 are "under examination." By law, he would get an audit letter for each year.

His lawyer says that his taxes for each year from 2002 through 2008 were also examined and that those cases have been closed. However, they will not produce those documents, either, citing transactions that carry into the period that is still under examination.

Of course, there is no law against someone under audit making their tax returns public. Here is the letter from his lawyers. They never actually use the word audit or state that any legal justification exists for concealing the returns. I think any form that you file with the IRS can be considered "under examination" until the last issue for that year is resolved.

For someone who owns 500 businesses, takes an aggressive approach to tax avoidance and is involved with complicated real-estate transactions, I could see issues lingering for several years, even in the absence of an audit.

https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/Tax_Doc.pdf

Generally, the statute of limitations is three years for the IRS to audit. There is no statute of limitations in cases of fraud or filing a fraudulent return. Assuming the three year statute of limitations applies, Trump's tax returns from 2012 back should not be under audit.

However, Trump's tax lawyer said that even the returns that are no longer under audit cannot be released since they are interconnected with the the tax returns still under audit.

It's bs anyhow that tax returns under audit can't be released. Trump is never going to release his tax returns unless Congress acts, which isn't going to happen with this Congress.

The only way that Trump can satisfactorily answer questions about who he owes money to, and particularly if he owes any money to Russians, is to release his tax returns, and that's not going to happen.