2020 Democratic Presidential Debate #2

Where did nan go?

Last post was around 10.


mrincredible said:
Where did nan go?
Last post was around 10.

 She tanked with Bernie !!!



With Warren, Harris and buttigieg all looking legit at this (still very early) juncture, Biden is in deep doo-doo. Really he was only top dog because he inherited the lead from his name recognition, and probably many people didn't know the other options. But now that other candidates are emerging, biden can barely hold serve. Tough to see how he bounces back 


Similar situation with Bernie, who has his base but no real upside. I don't think his base will bail, but at the same time I can't see him winning any undecideds based on last night's performance.


The line was over used last night, but it looks like the torch was indeed passed. 


I think Biden is in the same position as Jeb Bush in 2016.  Jeb was the initial front runner primarily based on name recognition.  He quickly wilted under the attacks from Trump.

I think Biden could go in the same direction during the primaries.


There's still a lot of time before the first primaries. It's tempting to make predictions, sure. But the dynamics will change as the field narrows down. 


I would love a ticket that included any two of Warren, Harris, and Buttigieg.  


Klinker said:
Interesting takes here. I was reading the NYT commentary and they saw it as a big win for Harris, a big loss for Biden, stasis for Bernie and a mild loss for Buttigieg who they thought failed to break out.  Obviously a loss for the remainders. 

I didn't watch the first 90 minutes, so I have no ratings of the performances.  But the evaluations given here seem pretty biased.  I probably could have correctly guessed most of the reactions of the people posting here yesterday afternoon.


mrincredible said:
Where did nan go?
Last post was around 10.

 I'm here.  I just spent 30 minutes writing a post about the debate and I clicked somewhere and lost the whole thing--and I have to run.  I'm so pissed. I have to stop writing long posts in the window and cut and paste instead.

Short version -- Kamala won the debate and she decimated Biden but her record still sucks. Buttigeig also spoke well but his disaster in South Bend revealed he is not ready to be president. 

Anyway, Bernie did not tank, although he was not as forceful as he could have been. He also got loaded questions like Tulsi did on debate 1.  He is the one the establishment hates the most because he is the biggest threat and that is why I support him.  His conclusion was the best because he stated the truth that if you want the kind of change all the candidates were talking about (sounding like Bernie) you have to take on special interests and the elites and he is the only one who will do that.  You can't just have "plans."  

I have lots of say but I have to run. . .later. .


I will say that Joe Biden got in the best line of the night with his “My time is up, I am sorry”. 


Yes Joe, your time most certainly is up. 


Google traffic during Pete's closing statement.



nan said:
 I'm here.  I just spent 30 minutes writing a post about the debate and I clicked somewhere and lost the whole thing--and I have to run.  I'm so pissed. I have to stop writing long posts in the window and cut and paste instead.

 All you need to do is post your videos from the Bernie supporters - has Kyle posted a winners and losers video from last night?


nan said:


Anyway, Bernie did not tank, although he was not as forceful as he could have been. 

 Wow! Translating from Nanese, I think this is about as bad as it could be for Bernie. I honestly didn't think he did that bad.


Klinker said:


nan said:

Anyway, Bernie did not tank, although he was not as forceful as he could have been. 
 Wow! Translating from Nanese, I think this is about as bad as it could be for Bernie. I honestly didn't think he did that bad.

 I thought he had one answer that he applied to all questions.  He seemed ill-prepared and just angry with little substance.  I don’t think he’d make a good president but I would vote for a toaster oven over Trump. But Bernie has zero chance. 


jeffl said:
 I thought he had one answer that he applied to all questions.  He seemed ill-prepared and just angry with little substance.  I don’t think he’d make a good president but I would vote for a toaster oven over Trump. But Bernie has zero chance. 

 His one answer is "We're going to have a revolution".  Once we take down the corporations, all the other concerns (such as those involving race and women's reproductive rights) are solved.


nan said:

Anyway, Bernie did not tank, although he was not as forceful as he could have been. He also got loaded questions like Tulsi did on debate 1.  

Bernie didn't get "loaded questions".  He objected to a question that was a direct quote of him.

Looking at what candidates have actually said and done is what's meant by "vetting".


I have a political activist / hardcore Bernie supporter Facebook friend, so much so that his profile picture is him shaking hands with Bernie. In a post today he says "I can admit that we have a lot of talent in our party and this field of candidates," which from him is the equivalent of a concession speech. 

Bernie had a good run, but as a presidential candidate his expiration date was July 26, 2016 -- the night Hillary was officially nominated. 


sbenois said:
i can't decide if Marianne Williamson looks more like Marlo Thomas or Tina Louise.

 Favorite comment of the night.


nohero said:
 His one answer is "We're going to have a revolution".  Once we take down the corporations, all the other concerns (such as those involving race and women's reproductive rights) are solved.

Right, because everything is currently run by the big corporations and monied interests, including the mainstream media.  Taking them on IS the big thing that needs to be done if we want Medicare for All, free college, etc.  It's heavy lifting. Only Bernie actually plans on putting these things in place.  The others are just sounding like him to get votes.  They will throw people a few bones and then go back to status quo incrementalism.  There really is one answer to all the questions. 

If he was such a "has been" and "over" than the mainstream media would not view him as such a threat that they have to have special meetings and two think tanks trying to take him down. 

The others copy Bernie, but there is no substitute for the real thing.   


Smedley said:
I have a political activist / hardcore Bernie supporter Facebook friend, so much so that his profile picture is him shaking hands with Bernie. In a post today he says "I can admit that we have a lot of talent in our party and this field of candidates," which from him is the equivalent of a concession speech. 
Bernie had a good run, but as a presidential candidate his expiration date was July 26, 2016 -- the night Hillary was officially nominated. 

 How did that work out for you?


What difference does it make?  It's in the past. Onto 2020.


Smedley said:
What difference does it make?  It's in the past. Onto 2020.

 History is our best teacher.  He who forgets the mistakes of the past is destined to repeat them.


Both true. But I'm not sure what connection you're trying to make with regard to the current election cycle. Are you saying that Bernie would have beaten Trump in 2016, and not nominating Bernie in 2020 will again be the reason the Democrats lose?


nan said:


nohero said:
 His one answer is "We're going to have a revolution".  Once we take down the corporations, all the other concerns (such as those involving race and women's reproductive rights) are solved.
Right, because everything is currently run by the big corporations and monied interests, including the mainstream media.  Taking them on IS the big thing that needs to be done if we want Medicare for All, free college, etc.  It's heavy lifting. Only Bernie actually plans on putting these things in place.  The others are just sounding like him to get votes.  They will throw people a few bones and then go back to status quo incrementalism.  There really is one answer to all the questions. 

No, that's not correct, not the way Bernie answers them.  It's not all economics and corporations.  Bernie doesn't get that.


Smedley said:
Both true. But I'm not sure what connection you're trying to make with regard to the current election cycle. Are you saying that Bernie would have beaten Trump in 2016, and not nominating Bernie in 2020 will again be the reason the Democrats lose?

 You get a yellow star on your chart.


I could see the argument that Bernie would have beat Trump in '16. I'm not convinced he would have, but maybe he would have.

But the notion that it's Bernie or bust in 2020 is way off kilter. It's a new day, it's time to turn the page. 


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